The FastDay Forum

I have just ordered sketchers go walk shoes after seeing someone mention them on here. They have very good reviews in Amazon. I have had fitflops before, they were comfy but didn't last me very long.

I also wear insoles inside my shoes that help with painful feet.

Thank you so much for those awesome links. My husband used to be one of those fidgeters--well, to tell the truth, he still is relatively a fidgeter. He was always thin (nickname Flaco) until back issues mace him less active, more of a recliner type of guy. I, on the other hand, am one of those people who you might have to put a mirror in front of to check for breathing.

Needless to say, I'm turning over a new leaf! I'm standing in the kitchen watching & then typing.

Chris

Woohoo, I actually got off the settee TWICE already! So... Tidy kitchen and dishwasher ready to go. Bonus! I deliberately left my iPad upstairs earlier, so if I wanted it, I had to move to get it. Is this what NEAT is aiming at? I hope so, because I might actually be able to train myself to do it!

I think the secret is some inefficiency in housework, even if counter intuitive - maximise trips upstairs to put things away, nipping out to the shops for a pint of milk, then again for some bread etc, and take stuff out to the rubbish every time you need to - leads to an ordered house, and lots of activity.

Thanks kencc for posting this. I find all this information about NEAT very interesting and helpful.

The only statistically significant difference in that chart is the Non-resting energy expenditure of the stable group being higher than the others by about 400 calories (which consequently increases the TDEE by a similar and also statistically significant amount).

So this fits with the argument about NEAT.

I am left wondering how much control we have over the NREE though - why does someone at a stable weight have a higher non-resting energy expenditure than a recent dieter. http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/88/4/906.long discusses the point but as far as I can see has no conclusion other than referring to improved efficiency ??

I guess this leaves us looking to do more NEAT and/or excercise in order to compensate for being more efficient. Hmm.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11101470 puts some numbers on low level activities :-

RESULTS:
Compared with metabolic rate in the supine position (5.4 +/- 1.5 kJ/min), energy expenditure increased while sitting motionless by 4 +/- 6%, while fidgeting while seated by 54 +/- 29% (P: < 0.0001), while standing motionless by 13 +/- 8% (P: < 0.0001), while fidgeting while standing by 94 +/- 38% (P: < 0.0001), while walking at 1.6 km/h by 154 +/- 38% (P: < 0.0001), while walking at 3.2 km/h by 202 +/- 45% (P: < 0.0001), and while walking at 4.8 km/h by 292 +/- 81% (P: < 0.0001). There was a significant, positive correlation between changes in energy expenditure and body weight for fidgeting-like activities while standing (r = 0.43, P: = 0.02) but not while seated.

CONCLUSIONS:
There is marked variance between subjects in the energy expenditure associated with self-selected fidgeting-like activities. The thermogenic potential of fidgeting-like and low-grade activities is sufficiently great to substantively contribute to energy balance.

So 30 minutes of walking at 1 mph (plodding) is worth 38 calories more than sitting figetting, which itself is worth more than sitting still etc etc.

Going well today - I'm moving everything up to ironing board/worktop height, so I cant be tempted to sit down as do my usual tasks. And running local errands every-time I can find one. Going to do some light gardening later too.

Tomorrow in the office will be much more of a challenge

kencc wrote: I think it probable that a major reason for subject1 becoming obese is that NEAT was too low; if subject1 had increased NEAT to subject2's level at the beginning then subject1 would have stayed at normal weight? Simplistic reasoning but I can't find an answer ... however maybe I'm too slow understanding stuff these days.

They got obese by eating too much

It remains a mystery to me too - the reduction in NEAT isn't matched to a reduction in physical activity so they call it "improved efficiency". They may as well call it "improved efficiency, errors and things we didn't measure" although to be fair there are references where they have measured the efficiency effect:-

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12609816 " At reduced weight, muscle work efficiency was increased in both cycle ergometry [mean (SD) change = +26.5 (26.7)%, P < 0.001] "

https://www.jci.org/articles/view/25977 "At Wt–10%, the gross mechanical efficiency (GME) of skeletal muscle while bicycling to generate 10 W of power was approximately 23% higher than at Wtinitial and was fully reversed during leptin administration at Wt–10%lep."

So if they used some accelerometers and such to monitor activity it may have been clearer what actually changed, rather than calculating an energy deficiency as NREE and explaining it away as more efficient NREE.

In the end our only option is to do more stuff if we want to compensate, or just eat less to match our actual TDEE.

I need a new pair of Fitflops, the ones I have are 4 or 5 years old, I'm tired of seeing them!!!

Well I managed not to sit down yesterday from 8.30am - 6.00pm other than some driving - felt it in my legs by the evening, but it was a productive day.

Sitting on the train now then due to sit in office all day - will go and walk and see as many people as possible.

Minumonline wrote: Going well today - I'm moving everything up to ironing board/worktop height, so I cant be tempted to sit down as do my usual tasks.

me too actually finding that working standing up is keeping me much more focused too I wiiiiiiiiiiish I'd have found this out at the beginning of my studies, rather than towards the end

I have had a standing desk for nearly 2 years, and find I'm much more productive. I walk around more it because I'm already standing. My work means for about 3-4 days a fortnight, I'm on the computer 10-14 hours a day. Sitting for that long hurts. Standing still would also hurt. So I have to move a lot.
I'm going to get one of those pedometers which fit around your wrist to make sure I do the 10,000

Thank you for posting all of this information Ken! I had forgotten that this is exactly what I did 10 years ago to lose weight, wasn't a formal thing. Just got disgusted with myself and as it was a beautiful morning, I shut off the TV, set down my cell phone and turned my back to my computer, went out to pull weeds and moved constantly, poor cat would beg me to stop so she could take her nap, lol. After that day, I kept moving from project to project, lost nearly 100 lbs and looked and felt fantastic. Then my late husband retired and 60 lbs crept back up. Many of the posts and suggestions on the forum remind me of my previous success and I'm working to get them back in my life now.

Having read this thread this morning I jumped out of bed (ok maybe jumped is an exaggeration) and promptly pulled a muscle in my back so not much NEATing for me today!