The FastDay Forum

@nursebean,

I lived through the fifties as an aware, impressionable child, and find the nostalgia for that period nauseating. The only reason it looks good in the movies is because of the huge amount of lying that went on everywhere. For women, it was a period of total suppression. Even a decade later I got turned down for a management job and was told by the hirer explicitly, that with my college record I would have got the job had I been a man, but women weren't given such jobs.

There was so much sexual and spousal abuse. Men were considered to have the right to beat their wives and their children. Children were victimized by teachers and priests and if they said anything they were yelled at and told to stay silent. Racial killings were going on in the U.S.. It was still legal to build neighborhoods where the property covenants explicitly stated that no Jews or black people could buy homes there. Gay people were routinely blackmailed and lived lives of self-hatred.

It was far from a paradise, and when I see the media romanticizing it it turns my stomach. We are all so fortunate to live in a world where though abuse and discrimination still occur, we no longer consider them acceptable.

I’ve been thinking so much lately about this post of yours, @peebles. I, too, grew up during the 50’s (born in 1941). Everything you say about it is true—we have made so much progress in human rights that I am very grateful in that respect to be living today.

There is one thing that wasn’t mentioned: the economy. Policy makers back then knew that to avoid the usual post-war Depression, caused mostly by demobilized military men suddenly flooding the labor market, it would be necessary to apply the lessons learned during the thirties and forties. The result was an unprecedented 30 years of prosperity accompanied by an unprecedented expansion of the middle class. I don’t know as much about Europe’s economic history, but I do know that those thirty years of economic growth are referred to there as “the Glorious Thirty”. I do realize that some socio-economic groups were left behind, but I speak in general.

Then, in 1980 or so, our policy makers began to very gradually abandon those economic lessons until by 2008 we had returned to the status quo ante 1929. The predictable result was the financial crash of 2008 and the hard times we have since been living through. The 1950’s was not an era I would like to return to except in regard to our sensible economic policy. I'm sure you know all this, peebles, but I wanted to remind us all that there was at least one good thing about that time that we could learn from today.

As regards, the Holiday Season, I am mainly in the “Bah, Humbug” class.

Marybeth,

Glad to hear from someone else who shares my memories of that period. Yours are probably much clearer.

There definitely was a change in economic policy that took place in the 1980s. Part of what allowed it to happen, though, was that as many more educated women and minorities entered the workforce after the laws were changed to limit discrimination, it wasn't as clear that families as a whole were losing their purchasing power, as the combination of both members of the couple's salary made up for it.

That economic comfort was unobtainable for most women in in the 1950s and early 60s who did not want to marry, in a culture where divorce was shocking. So many women put up with abuse or stayed in loveless marriages because they couldn't face the shame of divorce and because they couldn't support their children on what they could earn alone.

And Black people and Hispanics didn't share in that prosperity, either, as their economic opportunities and access to education was so limited.

So yes, I can't help but feel that the romanticized vision the media feeds us is very reactionary, and that it is part of a widespread agenda that involves pushing women back into the home and getting back the freedom to discriminate which we see driving the Right Wing.

Back in those days White WASP males in the US (and higher class protestants in the UK) and the women who married them and enjoyed living as housewives might have lived in that golden glow, but the rest of us, no. I am sure there were many Germans who were quietly very nostalgic for life in Germany in the 1930s, "When we had so much pride, so much to look forward to, and there was so little crime." But it is dangerous to romanticize golden ages that were golden for a few at the expense of the many!

Just ordered my Christmas bird (well a bird in a bird in a bird), before I go back to California. Earliest I have done this

Safe journey karen@rawkaren! X

Just ordered my Christmas bird (well a bird in a bird in a bird)

Turducken? How many people are you having to Christmas lunch?

Just ordered my Christmas bird (well a bird in a bird in a bird)

Turducken? How many people are you having to Christmas lunch?

Not quite sure yet @ssure. Planning ahead Turkey, goose and guinea fowl.

Turkey, goose and guinea fowl.

That's a good-sounding combination. Hmm. Plenty of goose fat to keep the turkey moist as well as the guinea fowl. Bronze turkey or similar?

Whenever I read about a multi-bird roast, I'm reminded of Rôti Sans Pareil – Roast Without Equal a.k.a. Death to Birds

What do you get when you stuff a tiny warbler inside a bunting, which is then put inside a lark then a thrush into a quail and then into a lapwing followed by a plover stuffed inside a partridge, followed by a woodcock inside a teal, then a guinea fowl inside a duck, then put into chicken, then inside a pheasant stuffed into a goose, then into a turkey, and finally all sixteen birds packed into a giant bustard to be roasted to perfection? [Recipe credited: Grimod de la Reynière, L'Almanach des Gourmands published volumes 1803 to 1812]

It sounds like something that ought to have been included in Babette's Feast (I must watch that again)

Was out shopping yesterday and was pleased that there was no holiday music to assault my ears--If I never hear Little Drummer Boy again, I'll be a happy old lady. Poor Santa was in his chair at the Mall, though, looking a little disconsolate with no kids around--maybe powers that be could have waited til after Thanksgiving (Nov. 27).

@Marybeth,

Did you get that 3 feet of snow? If so, that might be why the mall was empty.

I drove to where I go shopping today and was gratified to see lots of Thanksgiving products and nothing red or green in the food stores.

I'm with you on the songs. White Christmas is the one that brings me out in hives. The whole concept is something only someone living in Hollywood could come up with. White Christmas means kids skidding down icy highways on their way home, an hour spent making our long steep driveway negotiable, and not making it to our family Christmas in Connecticut. I've had a few too many White Thanksgivings over the years, too.

I must confess that I have bought 2 small Xmas puds today - I was going to make a batch this year but am being lazy. They are the Heston Blumenthal hidden clementine ones that everyone has gone mad for in previous years - thought I would take the opportunity to see what all the fuss is about while they were still in stock......will let you know!

@Madcatlady,

Christmas pudding isn't a concept that travels across the ocean, so I would love it if you'd explain what exactly these are. Are they what we'd call fruitcakes?

@peebles - it's a very rich fruit pudding, made with sultanas, breadcrumbs, alcohol, currants, cherries, candied peel etc, traditionally steamed for hours. I usually make my own to a lighter recipe with dried apricots, almonds and cherries. This one has the whole clementine inside, which should be interesting! Usually served with a brandy sauce or "Butter" made with icing sugar, butter and brandy or custard or cream and can be set on fire for presentation at the table

@peebles We have had very little snow --seems to be west of us (Buffalo) and little is predicted, but look at the low temps in this forecast--it's more like February http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.ph ... GvoqfnF_96

I think yesterday the kids were at home having dinner--I was traipsing around trying on shoes

Yes, bad weather here in the north is such a worry when holiday traveling is on the menu. Speaking of holidays, I happened on this website today that might be helpful to more secular folk trying to cope with said holidays:

http://files.parsetfss.com/2950e8df-331 ... oliday.pdf

@Rawkaren That sounds amazing. Something Henry XIII would have eaten! I ordered ham and pork roasts from Mt Gnomon Farm, where they free range rare breed Western Saddleback pigs. I get to pick it up at the Farmers Market later in December. I made my first prototype Christmas present yesterday. It works! Now for the production line.

[Debs]

Thought I had better post from Christmas Island!! Hot and humid with frequent tropical downpours here!! Tinsel, santa hats and fake snow abound in the shop though. Shop singular, there is only one! So that is a relief!
On the upside, the red crabs are on the move for their migration, so we have to sweep them off the road so as not to squash too many. Ho Ho Ho