The FastDay Forum

[janeg]

way to go jools7- respect! The third thing of something new/behaviour change is always the hardest- third day of a new diet, third day of giving up ..insert substance.., third time of new exercise, so well done on getting into it!
I'm having my third day of ignoring madmax- it's tough but i'll get through it
no, I really do want to but am struggling with motivation. I now when I get started it'll be fine. Read through the book and this one has beginners, intermediate and advanced protocols, so I might ease myself in gently...tomorrow (or the day after...)
I think the wet fish may be getting brought out

Umm. Still learning all about this, so I might lurk about the thread if ok. This was advertised on the telly yesterday. Anyone bought it?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/tabata-TM-Offic ... ta+workout

Well done jools!

Thank you so much for your support, @janeg & @rawkaren, makes motivation for me much easier!

Janeg - sounds good to have beginners/ intermediate etc in your book - even though on the protocol I'm doing, it's done according to HR, and the emphasis is on speed, not resistance, I think it would be really tough to do if you didn't already have some aerobic fitness. Interesting to consider - what's stopping you? Let it have its voice, it might have something useful to say! But then you can answer that voice back, and maybe reach a way of going forward - just a suggestion! - might be better than wet fish anyway? I love the rule of 3rds, btw, that sounds widely applicable!
Rawkaren, I don't know the Tabata ones, but sounds like it is more gym- than science-based, which is fine, depending on where you're coming from. I guess I have a science background, and so I'm happier with something that's been well-researched.

Happy exercising, whatever you're doing!

My weight lifting expert had to bail on me today, so I did HIIT instead. I tried the 8sec/12sec routine, and thought, since I'm reasonably fit, I would go for 20 minutes. OMG, I could barely make it for 10! My limitation was breathing, though my heart rate was pretty up there, too, and not coming down much with a 12 sec rest. I couldn't remember what tension level the bike should be on, so I kept messing about with it. I'm going to try to do this 3x per week.

Hi @MaryAnn, good for you for giving it a go, and well done to get to the 10 min mark! The mob whose protocol I'm following with the 8 sec/12 sec stuff is Steve Boutcher and his team from University of New South Wales. They suggest starting with 5 min warm up, 10 mins intervals to start with, working your way up to 20 mins over 2 weeks or so. Best to start on the lowest resistance they say - half a kg, although I don't know what that refers to. They say that speed is much more important than resistance, like 100-120 RPM, then 30-50 RPM for the recoveries, then 5 mins cool down at the end. If you have trouble measuring the intervals, they sell a music track, available on iTunes or from lifesprints.com for around A$30. And I think they have just released a book, there's a thread here about it today, so I'll have a look for it.

Yes, my heart rate is currently getting up to 164, which is supposedly maximum for my age - but I seem to survive! And only drops by 7-8 during the recoveries. So it is intense!

Good luck with that, let us know how you progress.

Cheers, Jools

Here is the link to the other string resources-links-f3/steve-boutcher-20-x-3-method-of-removing-belly-fat-t10629.html which gives a reference to a newspaper article about it, also where you can buy the book. I hope the link works, I'm not 100% sure how to put it in, so if it doesn't, just search for "Steve Boutcher"

Thanks for posting on this topic this week, @jools7 -- it coincided with my first HIIT week!

I got 3 solid workouts using Tabata (20s up, 10s down) protocol, first with 8 intervals (4 minutes) and 2nd/3rd with 10 intervals (5 minutes). I'm planning to do 4-6 minutes like this 3 times per week and build up to 8 minutes over a 16 week period and see how that works, with perhaps one exception:

How many times per week is best? I see 2-3 times per week is recommended most-often, however Tabata's studies were done 5 times per week (and was limited to 4 minutes, interestingly). I don't want to overtrain, and it is easy for me to do so because my attitude towards exercise-related activity is usually to go a bit overboard...

Glad I found this thread, I've been doing HIIT training starting last week and felt a bit unsure about how and what to do, so it's interesting reading everyone elses experience.
I live in a tiny flat and can't afford the gym so I've been training outside, once I tried sprinting (was nearly sick!) and the other two times I used my bike up the hill. My intervals have been more like 30 secs every 2 mins repeated five times, does that sound ok? It looks like most of you are going for shorter and more times!

My intervals have been more like 30 secs every 2 mins repeated five times, does that sound ok? It looks like most of you are going for shorter and more times!

I've seen intervals all over the place:

8s up, 12s down
20s up, 10s down
30s up, 60s down
30s up, 30s down
60s up, 90s down
2min up, 1min down

There seems to be no consensus on numbers, but the key (from most of those promoting this) is to raise the intensity up as high as possible for you. One early extreme version of this advice was, "if you do it correctly, you will see God!"

You might be helped by picking up a heartrate monitor and seeing how close to 95-100% max heart rate (estimated as 220 minus your age) you get to. Of course, before pushing yourself that hard, check with your doctor and make sure they don't have reservations about that kind of intensity.

Wife & I did intervals on the running track that was painted on the grass in our local park last summer, 400 meters as fast as possible with a 60 second rest.
400 meters takes me about 100 seconds nowadays, wife more like 120 seconds, so this roughly fitted the last one you mention BruceE.
It certainly worked for us. We started only being able to do 4 cycles but built up to 6 cycles after a couple of weeks. We only did this once a week, on Wednesday evenings, but our parkrun 5km times improved considerably during June and July.
The soccer players took over the field in the fall though and this stopped our interval training. I would rather limit running due to my hips wearing out so would like to start one of the stationary bike protocols, as soon as I can organize a suitable machine!

CreakyPete, have you heard of Yasso 800's? (http://www.runnersworld.com/race-training/yasso-800s) This is another type of interval, not quite as high-intensity as most HIIT routines, but a little longer as well (3-5 minutes up and about the same amount down).

Good stuff. Intervals certainly help you learn to run faster and teach your body to not be afraid of high-intensity (a fear drilled into our heads, I think, by well-meaning "fitness experts" who have for a long time promoted the longer duration "if you can't have a conversation with someone while you are doing it, you're pushing too hard" workouts).

Oh, and when you find a suitable HIIT machine, please post what you bought. We're also in the market for one in the next several months I think.

I'm trying to transition from running to walking for similar long-term reasons concerning my hips, knees, and ankles.

One more thing I picked up recently, a free interval timer app for the iPhone:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/interva ... 73568?mt=8

Very simple and intuitive to use. It runs banner ads to pay for the "free" app.

thanks so much for your input everyone, especially @BruceE and @creakypete - love the way you both care for your bodies! And thanks for the app reference, Bruce, I'm getting a bit sick of the timer I bought from lifesprints.com and I want to make my own!!

I've been reading Steve Boutcher's book (20 x 3), and as far as machines go, he says make sure you get one that you can vary the power on independently of the RPM - apparently some of the newer ones, when you slow down, they just make the resistance higher automatically! not a pretty sight! Also I think it's fairly standard these days to be able to set the wheel resistance in kg, e.g. 0.5, 1.0, 1.5 etc. He suggests starting off on 0.5 kg.

I think I'll be in the market for a machine myself soon, as my poor creaky crosstrainer is doing its best, but I reckon the silicone joints won't stand the friction strain much longer! I intend to try out an interval in the shop before I buy! But I think it's definitely improving my cycling - as you say, Bruce, the body (or mind!) isn't so afraid of going that little bit harder.

happy HIITing everyone!

hi again Bruce, just saw your post on frequency - yes, I think the jury's out! if you're pushing the duration up, I would be cutting down the frequency, 5 times a week sounds a bit much. Maybe four? Steve Boutcher says it's fine to do 4 a week, it's hard to strike a balance between being gung-ho and preaching to the lowest common denominator, I find. I think the heart-rate thing is a good check - although I've discovered that the "220 minus your age" thing is only a rule of thumb, since I seem to be able to get up to and maintain 100% reasonably easily using that system - Boutcher says in his book that the only really accurate way of assessing max HR is by doing the formal exercise testing with the mouthpiece etc (gah - probably make me gag I think!) and exercising to exhaustrion. He says it varies quite a bit, that some young 20 somethings can only get to 150, whereas some of us oldies can get up to 170. But I reckon I'm pretty safe getting intense at 164!

hi @Nicky_94, I think it's a matter of what you can do - I think it's really tricky to do shorter invervals if you're outdoors on a track. Boutcher also suggests skipping and boxing and stair-climbing, so I don't know whether any of those appeal?