The FastDay Forum

Hi everyone, I thought I'd also pop my head in here to let everyone know how I'm doing these days. Perhaps you may have seen on other threads that my hair is thinning at an alarming rate. To make a short story long, I had every test under the sun (including a scalp biopsy to see if the thinning hair was genetic/hereditary--it is NOT) and they found nothing amiss. The verdict is stress. So I'm working on trying to manage my stress better.

What does all of this have to do with maintaining, you ask? Well, I decided (primarily on Caroline's past posts about fasting being a mild form of stress; however positive for the body, it's still stress) to stop fasting once or twice a week and instead do daily 18-hr fasts. I have been having a bulletproof coffee (BPC) almost every day at the 16-hr mark and then eat lunch at 12 or 12:30. Some people might say I'm breaking the fast at 16 hours, and I guess technically I am, but I am trying to convince myself that since I'm staying in ketosis, the fast hasn't actually been broken until I actually eat, and that's at the 18-hr mark.

I do BPC because I have heard that the good fats and the antiflammatory properties of coconut oil are good for skin, hair, and nails. So in addition to eating a tablespoon of it a day, I'm also slathering it on my scalp at night before I go to bed. I hope this slows or stops the shed.

As far as my weight goes, I am staying fairly constant. I was a pound up this morning from last week, but I don't give too much credence to a single pound.

I think I can stay on an 18-hr daily fast the rest of my life, especially once I noticed that I get as hungry or even hungrier when I *do* eat breakfast. So no breakfast for me.

I hope all this fat I'm consuming (1 tbsp of grass-fed butter and 1 tbsp of coconut oil a day) isn't going to do me in and make me fatter!

I am looking forward to adding my once-weekly 24-hr fasts back into my routine. I am convinced that the act of abstaining from calories is a great thing for the body. I just have to get my stress levels under control and get the hair thing sorted out before I do that again.

OK so it seems I hit my goal weight this morning. I'm not particularly excited about this has happened many times in the past, most recently this time last year. I am now planning my maintenance. This week I did Sunday/Wednesday 500 cals and Thursday was to be a 1000 cal day. It ended up being 800 as I wasn't hungry. I have been experimenting this time around and have dropped 5kg in around 8 weeks, quite easily really. I have discovered a few things: firstly I really don't like 500 cal days, I feel hungry if I splash 100 cals on milk in my coffees, which is really the highlight of my day next I have taken to eating lunch on fast days, what a HUGE difference this has made. Instead of struggling with hunger ALL day, I only feel hungry for a few hours, then after a late lunch, I'm full till bed, amazing as I thought I would feel hungry in evening but not at all. Next I am planning on doing 2x500 and 1x1000 until I feel comfy and then 1x500, 2x1000 then finally 3x1000 as maintenance. This is Dr Krista Varady's version of maintenance. The other thing I have discovered is doing back to back fasts is quite easy if it's over 500 cals. I found that doing 500 Wednesday, then 800 Thursday was actually easier than fasting after a feast day. My next goal is to get more motivated in the kitchen. I have gone from an avid cook to grabbing what's easy. I'm disorganised. Summer is on its way, Spring is here and I love salads and they are easy, so I plan on the interesting salads I used to make.

OK so it seems I hit my goal weight this morning. I'm not particularly excited about this has happened many times in the past, most recently this time last year. I am now planning my maintenance.

Nonetheless, congratulations - and that reads like a measured, sensible plan for your maintenance. Good luck, @GMH

Hi all, I just thought I would add what I have been doing, as I have now been maintaining since June 2013 at or around my target weight of 55kg. I'm a committed 5:2 er as for me the health benefits are what attracted me to this in the first place. I did lose nearly 15kgs from my start in January 2013.

I'm 64 and only 5' tall, so my TDEE is only 1230 without exercise. My current BMI is 24.

I carry on with 5:2 pretty much every week - my strategy is to weigh myself weekly and if my weight is close to 53kg I will do 6:1, but if it is close to 55kg I do 5:2. I try and stick to 500 calories on fast days, which I have as one evening meal, although I am so used to doing it now that I rarely actually weigh or calculate calories, unless it is a new recipe. Usual fast days are Monday and Thursday.

I don't count calories on non-fast days, but I eat a lot less carbs than I used to and what I do have are wholegrain. I eat lots of veggies and fruit and am consciously trying to lower my intake of animal protein. I think my portion sizes are pretty good now but I do tend to drink several glasses of wine on non-fast days, without which I would probably find myself doing 6:1 more often. I actually increased my intake of good fats, nuts, avocados and bananas after reaching my target weight, so that helps me to maintain too. I rarely eat much in the way of sweet things now, I find fruit plenty sweet enough without adding any sugar or honey. I still enjoy a square of dark chocolate now and again, but I find that I don't think about it very often (I used to eat half a bar of chocolate pretty much every day....).

I realised a couple of months ago that since I have been maintaining I have got a lot more lazy and not been doing regular exercise, so I've given myself a talking to and have committed to working on lowering my fat%, which is still around 35 and increasing my muscle% which is currently about 27.
So now I've started couch to 5k with the aim of getting fit enough to start doing HIIT.

I don't envisage ever stopping 5:2.

Blood test results

I had last had them done a year and 1/2 before I began fasting, and just had them redone this year (total 3 years between tests). I met my goal a year ago (and passed it a bit) and have maintained pretty well. I believe my diet is healthier with less white carbs, but I have by no means eliminated them! Definitely have increased the fat intake. I am a white female, upper 50s (WHEN did THAT happen?).
First numbers are from the tests 3 years ago, second one are this year's.

Cholesterol 189 mg/dL 213 mg/dL
200-239 borderline
Triglycerides
HDL 52 mg/dL 71 mg/dL
Desirable: >65
LDL 110 mg/dL 120 mg/dL
Desirable: <130
LDL/HDL 2.1 1.7
Chol/HDL 3.6 3.0

So, although both good and bad cholesterol went up, the ratio got better and I am still in the desirable category. Upshot, doc is happy with the results! What was really interesting about these blood tests – all sorts of things were tested – and some of the results showed that my immune system was being stressed. Happens these tests were taken 2 weeks after my massive doses of prednisone to combat the poison ivy. Two weeks later, I think I was still itching!

I'm not sure if I should be posting here any more, my weight is gradually creeping up. I'm having trouble sticking to 5:2, fast days always end up in a binge. I've had only three successful fast days in the last few months, I've tried 16:8 but it doesn't help, my weight still increases. It's not an awful amount - yet, just 5lb over, but instead of shifting it I seem to be adding more each week. I'm feeling uncomfortable and the roll of fat has returned to my midriff, I hope I can stop this before it gets out of control and I end up back where I started.

@coffeetime I have found that skipping breakfast every day, and the occasional lunch works quite well-I weigh daily. I have to throw in an occasional proper fast, but I don't do any counting or worry about what I eat or drink otherwise . Not sure if this will help you but I am managing to keep within a kilo weight range.

@coffeetime I think you have pinpointed your problem - you aren't in control of your fast days. Any idea why? Have you planned what you are going to eat? What are you bingeing on and why is it to hand? Is there some emotional stuff going on? I think you need to take yourself in hand and try really hard to get in the zone of a fast day. Just because you hit your target doesn't mean it's okay to let them slide.... Maybe an alternative strategy for that moment when something is about to be put in your mouth!

fast days always end up in a binge.

That reads like it's very frustrating, @coffeetime. I never know if by 'binge' posters mean that they ate more than they'd planned to eat or if they mean it in a more clinical sense (implying eating at speed, in large volumes, past the point of pain, under conditions of secrecy etc.).

The
Happy Eaters
website has a forum where people discuss useful books. From various IF sites, my anecdotal impression is that it seems as if the sense of deprivation or restriction that accompanies IF for some people can trigger binge eating episodes (my impression is subjective and from people's reports and they tend to be at the less painful end of the clinical continuum - tho' still distressing). One of the books that I've regularly seen recommended and commended is:

How to Have Your Cake and Your Skinny Jeans Too: Stop Binge Eating, Overeating and Dieting For Good Get the Naturally Thin Body You Crave From the Inside Out by Josie Spinardi

The overviews that I've seen highlight the following points:

The Dieting Triangle of Despair: Diet ---> Binge ---> Beat Self Up for Perceived Lack of Self-Discipline and Resolve to

Diet etc. etc.

Spinardi identifies 7 common reasons why the usual forms of dieting are inappropriate for sustainable, healthy weight loss:
1 Dieting intensifies cravings and preoccupation with food.
2 Dieting makes you eat more, not less. (For every diet there is an equal opposing binge. The extent and ferocity with which you binge is directly proportional to the extent to which you restrict what you eat.)
3 Dieting makes you feel out of control with food.
4 Dieting increases both emotional distress and the likelihood that you'll eat in response to the stress.
5 Dieting creates a whole new category of overeating called "Eating Cuz You Ate."
6 Diets don't model naturally thin eaters' behaviour.
7 Diets do not resolve the real reasons you eat when you're not hungry.

Spinardi emphasises what she calls Hunger-Directed Eating and highlights 5 types of Non-Hunger Eating:
1 Gasping for Food
2 Eating Cuz You Ate (I've blown the FD, I may as well carry on blowing it)
3 Mean Girl Munchies
4 Licking Your Wounds
5 Recreational Eating

-----

"When deprivation is involved, not only to the pounds stay put, your feelings of powerlessness soar. So, an eating approach that completely eliminates deprivation is not only favorable, it is crucial to successfully achieving your long-term leanness."

"Binge eating is the natural result of food restriction, while emotional eating is the result of a (completely solvable) deficit in one's emotional management skill set."

[Re: food choices} "Because managing your behavior by an iron will - rather than autopilot - is a constant, energy-draining source of conflict and tension. You're in an undending arm wrestle between "Do It!" and "Don't do it!" The instant you're weakened, distracted, or slightly off your game, your resolve caves in the direction of whatever is the least painful, and most pleasurable in that moment."

"Hunger Directed Eating is not the Eat-When-You're-Hungry-and-Stop-When-You're-Full Diet. This completely undermines the effectiveness of these body-connecting habits by turning them into a diet with two rules--waiting until you're hungry and stopping when you're full. As we've seen, all sorts of things go (terribly) wrong when we introduce rules into our eating. Foremost, it leads directly to more overeating."

"If physical hunger isn't what launched your current eating episode, then how in the world is being satisfied going to be what signals you to stop? Hunger and fullness are like two bookends. If hunger is what starts you eating, then feeling satisfied would naturally be what makes it easy to stop. However, if feeling frustrated with a project at work is what initiated your eating, then what is your signal to stop? When the problem is solved? When the chips and salsa are gone? When you hear someone coming down the hall?"

Some people don't seem to feel deprived or restricted with IF but others do - it's not clear why and it seems that feelings towards fast days can change over time.

As far as I can tell, people tend to pick the bits of the book that work for them and ditch the parts that feel like they'd be onerous (such as her suggestion to check in with yourself after various food choices and meals and record your rating for hunger, mood, energy and concentration at various times ).

In the past year, I've seen a number of people on a different forum adopt Spinardi's advice in various food areas and they've mostly reported positive changes in their drive to binge or over-eat.

I've no idea if any of the above might be helpful to you. Good Luck.

Thank you @Merlin, @Belindab and @SSure, I'm a comfort eater and every now and then it gets out of control and I find myself eating anything and everything for several hours, feeling full and uncomfortable doesn't stop me.

Thanks for your long and helpful reply SSure, a lot of that applies to me, I got down to my maintenance weight of 9st 7lb, I managed to keep within a lb or two of that weight for a year so this is worrying me - which just makes it worse. I'll have a look at that book, it might be just what I need.

*I've looked on Amazon for the book and there is only a Kindle edition, I don't have Kindle so hopefully it will be published in book form soon.

@coffeetime you can read kindle books on your computer - you just need to download the app.

I am pleased to say that I am just within the boundry of my maintenance weight once again, so although I would like to get down to the lower end at least I'm not over my maintenance weight any more, hooray!

Hello on this lovely morning, mainteneers! Well, I guess it may be neither morning nor lovely where you are
I'm just stopping in to report that maintenance is still going well with me. I'm on the 6:1 plan, so today, Tuesday, is my weigh day - the day after my fast.
Hang in there, fellow fasters and no-longer-fasters. Strugglers and easy-sailors alike. It's worth the journey, isn't it!

Oops, I didn't realise that I hadn't popped in here this month. Well, I am still over target by the 2lb that I gained on my first holiday of the summer but have lost the other 4 that I gained on the second holiday and quite easily and quickly too. I am mostly doing 5:2, 16:8, low carb, MFP calorie counting, fitbit stepping and daily weighing. Obsessed? Moi?
I have been away and out for days quite a lot recently so I have been eating more poorly than usual but according to MFP my weekly intake is under target. I am still enjoying eating this way and think that one of the most helpful things I do is plan what I'm going to eat and make a mental note of the calories if I can't enter them into MFP straight away. I always check MFP before eating any extras to ensure that I can afford them. I am convinced that the key is mindfulness.

Thank you @Nicky_94, I didn't know that it was possible to download kindle books onto a computer. Ooooh that opens a whole new reading experience. Perhaps I can sit here reading instead of overeating and it's much cheaper to buy kindle books rather than the paper ones, I do love turning the pages and the smell and touch of them though.

Wow, @Wendy Darling, you are committed! I am currently in Germany and eating really badly. I can't imagine how much weight I have put on but it will be back to 5:2 on my return!