The FastDay Forum

I seem to recall hearing that on Dr Mosley's documentary. So if that is true, am I not lowering the growth hormone if I eat small meals during my fast day?

Thanks!!

[carorees]

You mean raise growth hormone! It's IGF1 we want to lower.

Well, I think the lowering of IGF1 happens by the calorie restriction. Lowering IGF1 by reducing calories also helps to switch on autophagy which is the body's repair mechanism. Fasting itself may also encourage this but we don't really know.

During fasting, we first use up our glycogen stores in the liver and as they decrease we turn to fat as a fuel. The fat burning that happens during fasting results in substances called ketone bodies being produced. The ketones are used by the body for energy but not all cells can use ketones. One type of cell that can't use ketones is cancer cells. The brain does use ketones and it seems to do well on them with new nerve cells being grown.

In order to burn fat, insulin levels (which are often high in people who are overweight and/or eat high levels of carbohydrates) are reduced. Insulin is the hormone that turns excess foods into fat. Low insulin levels allow the stored fat to be released and carried to the liver where it is turned into ketones. Growth hormone is the hormone that stops your body from using protein for energy and hence protects your muscles from wasting. Lower insulin levels are generally a good thing for many reasons.

Longer fasting might result in better fat burning which might bring additional benefits over simple calorie restriction in brain health, cancer protection and improving diabetes and cancer risk.

But, weight loss itself, however achieved brings huge improvements in all these areas.

So the answer to your question is that eating small meals throughout the day may not be quite as good as a complete fast but no-one knows. The biggest health benefits of the 5:2 come from weight loss, which you will get by having very few calories on the fast days. If spreading your calories over the day is the best way for you to cope with fast days, then you should stick to that because sticking to the 5:2 lifestyle and so cutting your calorie intake (and thereby losing weight) is more important than exactly how you do it.

Hope that makes some kind of sense...writing on my phone, so it is hard to keep the train of thought in order!

i'm no longer losing weight but AM still doing 24 hours fasts twice a week.
just used to it now.

[Tracieknits]

Are you consuming more than 500 calories in the roughly 36 hour window? Or are you fasting 24 hours and then eating as you like that evening?

I think ideally, one stops eating at maybe 10pm on Monday, then consumes no more than 500 calories on Tuesday, and then wakes up Wednesday morning and has breakfast. So maybe 32 to 36 hours with only 500 or 600 calories consumed.

I would think that if you go from 7pm Monday night until 7pm Tuesday night fasting, then eat what you like on Tuesday night, it could be possible to eat so much that it wipes out your hard work.

I seem to be doing this quite naturally now that I'm into my fourth week, although do find some days harder than others.

I had dinner on Sunday at 5 p.m. Then didn't eat until 5 p.m.on Monday, when I have most of my 500 cals (I allow myself a bovil drink during the day and a low cal hot choc in the evening), and still haven't eaten yet (Tuesday morning). I try to have a 24hr fast, followed by another 16 hr fast (after my 500 cal feast) - Then I have something nice!!!

I seem to be doing this quite naturally now that I'm into my fourth week, although do find some days harder than others.

I had dinner on Sunday at 5 p.m. Then didn't eat until 5 p.m.on Monday, when I have most of my 500 cals (I allow myself a bovil drink during the day and a low cal hot choc in the evening), and still haven't eaten yet (Tuesday morning). I try to have a 24hr fast, followed by another 16 hr fast (after my 500 cal feast) - Then I have something nice!!!

Are you sure you're not me, Sunshine24?! That's exactly what I do, including the Bovril during the day and a low cal hot choc (Options Belgian Chocolate) drink in the evening. Spooky!

We could be living parallel lives in different parts of the Country (unless that is, you're in Suffolk too!!)

I've been fasting since September.
I go from Sunday lunch to Tuesday lunch on 500 calories
and Wednesday supper to Friday lunch on 500 calories
every week.

[carorees]

So, how do you split your calories on those days TIP? Do you mean you miss lunch on Sunday or start after lunch? Am I right in thinking the only normal days for you are Wednesdays and Saturdays? Or am I missing something?

This was very helpful. Thank you all and Caroline. But isn't IGF1 a growth hormone? I thought that's what we were trying to lower.

I do fast for as close to 24 hours as possible believing I get the best benefit from this. However, I do want to feel ok with having a broth or something in the middle of my fast if I need it to get me over the hump.

[carorees]

IGF1 is A growth factor but not "growth hormone" or GH! The naming of biological molecules is completely ridiculous!

GH is released during fasting and peaks overnight usually. Children grow in their sleep because of this! GH does not usually cause growth in adults where its main role is to prevent protein from being used to provide energy and so protect your muscles. However in extreme fasting/calorie restriction GH is produced in enough quantities to cause some growth. I remember my physiology lecturer telling us that survivors of the Nazi death camps actually had grown slightly due to the prolonged calorie deprivation!

It is not worth worrying whether 24 hour fasts give better health benefits if not having your broth makes fasting difficult. The most important thing is to find a way of fasting/eating very few calories that is sustainable.

On a Monday I skip breakfast and lunch, just drink loads of tea and then have a 500 calorie supper (I'm not losing much weight any more so allow myself the extra 75 from the milk in tea)
Tuesday = no breakfast (never have ...), small lunch, whatever I like for supper.
Wednesday = same as tuesday
Thursday = same as monday
Friday = no breakfast, small lunch, pizza and red wine for supper
Saturday = big breakfast, no lunch, big supper
Sunday = big breakfast, HUGE roast sunday lunch, no supper

so I never feel hungry on Monday - having eaten lots for the 3 days before.
It works
it includes 2 x 24 hour fasts
I get to enjoy weekends

[carorees]

OK, that makes lots of sense now you have written it out like that! I am similar but rather than have no breakfast and some lunch I'm more of a brunch sort of person, so that's what usually happens at weekends. Weekdays I may have a small breakfast on non-fast days but on fast days I just have an evening meal. Not so different really.