The FastDay Forum

I'm on holiday and having a fabulous time! Managed to fast on Saturday so have the rest of the week to enjoy whether I throw in a an extra fast or not! Good luck everyone trying out a liquid fast! :0)

What does 36 hour liquid fasting consist of.

What kind of liquid is consumed.

Do the liquids have calories? or is it just water?

Sounds horrible and away from "purist" 5:2 / 4:3 if there is such a thing, which allows a relatively comfortable consumption of 1/4 TDEE (500 for women and 600 for men, on average) in whatever form that takes.

I don't know what the OP means by 'liquid fast', but for me when I do it, it is calorie-free from supper time on Sunday night through to breakfast (or a little later morning) on day 3, so day 2 in the middle is completely calorie-free, which means roughly 36 hours of no calories.

I do this method sometimes, and the 500 calorie day sometimes, depending on the rest of my day. I donate plasma 2 times per week, and I find I get very tired and worthless if I try to donate on a completely calorie-free fast day, but I do just fine if I donate on a 500 calorie day. So if my donation day and fast day coincide, then I do the 500 calories, if not, I do liquid fast.

It is not, in fact, 'horrible', nor is there any such thing as a 'purist' 5:2, which is what makes this WOE so wonderful for all of us. We can tweak it to fit our lifestyle and bodies.

For me, I find that if I don't consume any calories at all, my 'hunger waves' are relatively mild and easily controlled with a beverage. I do not like black coffee or tea, so my beverage of choice is almost exclusively water. I do allow myself one diet soda on my fast days if needed, mostly for the caffeine content and not always needed.

Once I eat, even on my 500 calorie days, I become quite hungry and it is more difficult for me to control my intake. 500 calorie days can sometimes become 600-700 calorie days.

Because I know this about myself, and I know that 'extreme' calorie restriction for those short periods gives the best health result in things like reduction of the IGF hormone levels and improving problems like insulin resistance and so on, I like to do liquid only fasts whenever possible.

To each his/her own. Dr. Mosley (not sure if I'm spelling that right) developed the 500 calorie option because he could not comfortably do the full liquid fast on a regular basis, though he did try that process first (in the documentary). He developed his program to make it more 'doable' for him. It probably is more comfortable for most people. But he even says it's an alternative for those who can't or don't want to do complete fasts.

Neither way is 'wrong'. Merely another wonderful set of variations that make this WOE so flexible!

I'm in today, just starting to feel a little "weird", but not hungry. Overindulged big time over the weekend, so this 36 hour fast will be a welcome relief for my body and mind.

Shanti has it just about right, I reckon. And, if I remember correctly, rather than exactly 5/600 calories. the recommendation is to eat less than 5/600 cals.

The scientists on the Horizon programme (anniversary tomorrow, folks! ) were all of the opinion that the longer you can fast, the better. The intention is to put the body's cells under pressure, so that they begin the self-repair process.

Tonight I intended to have a low-cal dinner - <200 cals - but I realised that I had some Thai red curry sauce that needed using up, so I used some of that along with 100g of coconut milk, which bumped up the cals to 330 or so.

That's all I'll have - the kitchen is now closed - until tomorrow round about 11, giving me a 40-hour fast.

Having had a weekend of parties and loads of food I am really looking forward to 36 hour tomorrow. Anniversaries and Birthdays play havoc with 5:2 but back in track on Tuesday! Swimming with grandchild will help!

@Shanti and hilaryjane

My take on it and only my opinion is that 36 hour liquid fasting or liquid fasting of any length or degree is mutually exclusive from 5:2 as prepared by MM. Liquid fasting is not part of the 5:2 way of life its just what some 5:2ers and 4:3ers have chosen to do as a "supplement" much like taking one of those natural supplements advertised on this site supporting 5:2.

Liquid fasting is not an "extension" or variation of 5:2 and hopefully newcomers wont think that they would have to stop eating for 36 hours and only drink for that length of time. Part of what attracts me to 5:2 fast or better said 5:2 restrictive calorie input days is that I still actually can eat and graze like i always do. I can pick up an apple, or a banana and eat through the day, making one of my meals almost "normal" in quantity. I just don't do the icecream or chocolate or wine or the extra grazing i might do otherwise on my 3 "special days". Love the simplicity of that.

Liquid fasting is I guess a variation of IF or Interrmittent Fasting dieting but thats a broader concept. In my opinion its an "extreme" variation but thats a matter of opinion as some people thing 500 calories on a 24/36 hour period is evil.

So Liquid fasting is just another type of diet .. i guess just like Lemon detox or cabbage diet or Low carbs etc. Nothing wrong with combining 2 diet forms thought i dont think anyone has studied the combinations as yet as to which one would add to the 5:2 regime to make any evaluation of which is the best combination for "acceptable" results from a weight loss point of view.

So if it works for you carry on. But it's not 5:2.

@Breadand Wine.. comment

And, if I remember correctly, rather than exactly 5/600 calories. the recommendation is to eat less than 5/600 cals

This i have never read or missed it. I thought you don't eat "under" but "at" or close to 500/600 i.e. 1/4 of average TDEE or more than 500/600 if you TDEE is over 2000/2400. Never "under" as this is potentially nutritionally deficient and also just plain hard to sustain for the majority. I don't think i read in here people claiming good behaviour for only consuming 100 or 200 calories on their "fast day" and shouldn't.

Indeed could liquid fasting be nutritionally deficient though I guess our body stores nutrition and thats why we can last without food or water for days but I dont think 5:2 is meant to encourage extended fasting of any sort.

Anyway to cut a long explanation short. In my opinion, and without judgement on anybody I believe 5:2 and liquid fasting are different things and if a 5:2er wants to liquid fast, that's their prerogative and if it works for them without bad health implications then go for it.

Liquid fasting is not for me anyway. 36 hours of nil or <50 calories I could not endure, and function properly at work. I work 6 days a week so effect on my concentration would be too poor plus I worry about nutritional intake and headaches. Anyway I like plain old simple 5:2/4:3 on its own.

Having said that its fast day for me and off to the fridge to get some corn kernels to chew on

@Shanti and hilaryjane

My take on it and only my opinion is that 36 hour liquid fasting or liquid fasting of any length or degree is mutually exclusive from 5:2 as prepared by MM. Liquid fasting is not part of the 5:2 way of life its just what some 5:2ers and 4:3ers have chosen to do as a "supplement" much like taking one of those natural supplements advertised on this site supporting 5:2.

So Liquid fasting is just another type of diet .. i guess just like Lemon detox or cabbage diet or Low carbs etc. Nothing wrong with combining 2 diet forms thought i dont think anyone has studied the combinations as yet as to which one would add to the 5:2 regime to make any evaluation of which is the best combination for "acceptable" results from a weight loss point of view.

Hmm. This feels a bit defensive or contentious as I read it. If 500 calories/day works for you, great. But it is not a reason to dismiss those of us who do occasional or almost exclusive liquid fasts on our fast days. It is no more 'just another diet' than your "purest" 5:2 or 4:3 is. No more right or wrong, no more 'good' or 'bad'.

I have not yet bought MM's book, but have watched the documentary numerous times. His first fast attempt was, in fact, an almost exclusively liquid fast. He consumed a very small instant-soup-type packet that was less than 100 calories, and that was his entire calorie consumption every day for four full days. He did say that it was miserable and he never wanted to do it again, but the health benefits in his lab work were immediate and dramatic. He continued to search other methods to see if there was something that conveyed similar results without quite so much sacrifice and pain.

If you read through any of the 'nerdy stuff' on fasting available here on the forums, the research consistently comes back to show that - within reason, the longer you extend your absolute fast, the more the health benefits kick in. A fast gives your body rest from glucose/insulin teeter-totter. So much of current 'health' news wants people to eat every 2-3 hours to keep a consistent blood sugar, but what the newest research is proving is that all that does is keep a constant, high level of insulin in our bloodstream so our body's cells seem to fatigue or become insulin resistant. It's all very new and the studies are only very vague and general. It will take a lot longer to be able to draw general conclusions.

But a liquid fast for 36 hours is at least no more harmful than the "pure" 5:2, and in many studies seems to have greater benefit.

So. With all due respect, please allow for the variations in our bodies and our lives. If liquid fast is not for you, then don't do it. Don't try to bash those of us who do. This is not a matter of "I'm right and you're wrong."

Cheers!

I knew my post would attract criticism but about 5 times i said its perfectly fine for people to liquid fast if that's what is good and right for them. Just not for me. and this is a forum to discuss our personal viewpoints. I have reread my post and dont see anywhere i have "bashed anyone" about their aversion to solids for extended periods.

You missed the point of my long post. that is. not to classify liquid fasting and no eating of any solids for 36 hours even 24 hours as part of 5:2 but it of course a type of "Intermitent fasting". That's all.

Indeed MM didnt want to do the no calorie thing and hence was born 5:2.

Keep liquid fasting if you want.

As to nutritional safety.. glad its good and not dangerous for anyone and i fyou get to your goals quicker go for it. I admire your courage. It has been practiced for centuries in the Muslim world for strong religious reason and indeed i know many people from the continent currently going through Ramadam fasting right now which involves no food OR WATER so indeed the body can cope. I dont think its as long as 36 hours though https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramadan

Dont worry my post wasnt meant to be an "Im right your wrong" thing in fact I;m ready to admit im normally wrong

Thanks, Shanti, saved me making a long reply - and thanks too, Juliana, for the clarification.

You missed the point of my long post. that is. not to classify liquid fasting and no eating of any solids for 36 hours even 24 hours as part of 5:2 but it of course a type of "Intermitent fasting". That's all.

Is it just a question of semantics, then? If I fast on 2 days a week - LF or <600 cals - and I eat normally on the other 5 days, well, whichever way you slice it, that's 5:2 in my book.

That is another reason that this WOL is so great - it is very flexible.

Over the last 18 months I have:
Eaten <1200 calories 2 days a week for 6 months
Eaten <600 calories 2 days a week for 2 months
Eaten <600 calories on one day and fasted for 24 hours on another for several months.

And now I'm doing a version of 6:1 where I try to eat <200 cals once a week for three weeks, the liquid fast on the fourth. With the odd 24 hour 'mini-fast' - missing breakfast and lunch - thrown in later in the week if I've over-indulged (or intend to over-indulge).

Completely flexible, you see!

Cheers, B&W

Cogent to this subject, here is a great blog written by a bloke who actually contacted the scientists from the documentary to ask this very question.

Quick, easy and fun read. Might help clarify a great deal.

http://feedfastfeast.com/2012/08/25/gra ... the-horns/

As always, the science is continuing to grow as the data rolls in and we learn more. Love being in the health-care field. New discoveries happen all the time.

Fasting again today, Wednesday. The weather this week is beautiful for winter (21 today and sunny) so I'll be taking my laptop outside to work. (Benefit of working from home #457) And I suppose I'd better get into the front garden and do some weeding too, before the house is consumed.

Shanti, I found that blog post very interesting. Something else that is interesting is that I find it easier to have no calories for the 36 hours. My body definitely appreciates fasting.

@Shanti re feedfastfeast.com what a great link, thanks. I will have a good read later today.

Thank you Shanti, that makes it very clear! I am very pleased to hear that the way I have chosen to apply 5:2 has not only given me a steady, continuing weight loss (almost five months and counting) but is also maximising the potential health benefits.

Still on holiday, but throwing in a fast today as I'm feeling so full from holiday food I am missing my fasts! Had an awful night as baby has a cold so he slept in my very narrow allegedly double bed only to have my daughter join us at 3am so no sleep for me! Despite all having a great holiday, weather has been fabulous and the beach here is amazing!

Happy fasting all and nothing to add apart from well said shanti. Whatever variation of 5:2 we choose to use we should all be mindful to support each other on our journeys to better health!

I'm in today, too! Mariposa - I'm so impressed you can fast while on Holiday! We took the kids on a 13 day trip to Disney World earlier this summer, and I faithfully did 16:8 nearly every day, but never did do a complete fast - even though I could tell my body would have appreciated the break. Too much good food to pass anything by.

My Monday's fast day was not a complete liquid fast. As I think I mentioned in this thread already, I donate plasma 2x/week and have found that if I do a complete liquid fast and donate, I feel really lousy. However, I still ate very light - half a cup of 1% fat cottage cheese before and another half cup after - and felt just fine.

Today is liquid only and I'm looking forward to it. Supper was heavy last night and then I did a longer than usual workout and increased my running distance later in the evening. Might be just my imagination, but I feel like letting a recovery day and fast day fall on the same day seems to really improve my recovery/healing time from any muscle soreness I've induced. Maybe part of that whole 'repair' thing we're trying to induce by fasting?

Anyway, here's to everyone fasting today! I raise my water bottle to you! Have a great day!!