The FastDay Forum

[Debs]

Dear All,
Welcome to the highest tent in the Glamping Grounds. This tent is for all those for whom eating is so much more than eating because we like to. These are those amongst us, myself included, for whom food is, or has been, a crutch to lean on. It is more than just food, more a wall to hide behind to cover up other problems in our lives.

I have struggled with a long and unhealthy relationship with food due to my mother who has spent her life hating what she looks like but not having the tools or support to do anything about it. There was a tipping point and I no longer have to worry abput that and can recognise why I eating. Can you???

Oh yes! I know where you are coming from. I LOVE my food and have used it as comfort for many, many years. I thought that once I left the catering industry (cook, chef etc) I would lose weight, but that didn't happen. Cooking and eating, especially eating were my, very childish, way to feel good, to reward myself in the 'well I {insert negative here, can't have, don't have, I'm poor etc} but I can feel good with food.

Food does make you feel good, the human race would have died out if we didn't actually like food and if you feel that the only time you get an endorphin boost is when you eat, you carry on eating. Its taken a while but I now get my endorphin's from exercise and enjoy my food in smaller quantities and better quality.

Thanks so much for setting up this tent, @Debs. I have a lot to say about my complicated relationship with food, but I'm way too tired to string more than a couple of words together tonight. And I'm really looking forward to hearing other people's stories here- I naturally always want to dig deeper!

A tipping point, Debs? Love to hear more!!

Great idea Debs...
**** snips ribbon with sharp scissors*****
" I now declare the Mountaineering Tent open!"
( nice of the Queen to pop in isn't it! )
Will be back when not as tired as right now! XX

*sticks hand in tent to wave*

Excellent idea. This tent needs to be a cosy yurt with a log fire (with ventilation shaft) and some big fluffy rugs and bean bags so we can all get comfy and mull over things.

I will be here at some point when I am not doing things like going work!

Re the emotional issues around food: comfort eating has been a big part of my life, but it is not just that. There was an element of self-harm too. I can look back to times of miserably cramming food into myself, beyond the point where I felt sick, and there was a desire to punish myself for being fat and weak-willed (as I saw it).
I've learnt to forgive myself. Yes I may have crazy mixed-up emotions about food, but hey, all humans have got some hang-ups and it's not as if I'm plotting mass-murderer or even dropping litter. Yes my body may be carrying excess weight, but it is doing brilliantly the job it was designed to do.

oooh, @Kentishlass, that's a painful dynamic. I deffo also have an internal figure from time to time who doesn't completely wish me well, mine is more - "oh you've had a tough day, and you're too tired to cook, so gorge yourself with chips (crisps) as a reward and to make you feel better". These voices are often semi-conscious, so we're not aware of what they're really saying or what their motives are. It's only in recent times that I've begun to question this one, and found out her motives are not completely pure! It goes something like this:

Me (or the part of me who's interested in what's really happening): oh, so you want me to eat chips? But you know they're not entirely good for me when I have them too often, so what's the story?

Voice: but go on, you know you want them!

Me: yes, that's true, but I'm not eating them until you answer my question!

Voice: well, you'll be hungry later and you won't allow yourself them later, so you'd better dig in now before you stop yourself

Me: I'm trying here to climb my mountain, and walk the path that is best for the most of my parts at any given time, and you're recommending that I ignore that part of me in order to indulge? Sorry, that's just going to create an internal backlash, I won't do it


Hmm, many of those kinds of conversations in my life! The thing I've found is, once you engage with these figures and get them to justify themselves, they're often fairly one-dimensional, remnants of addictive pathways in your brain, who just can't think outside the square, and just bang on about the same old thing. That's just too boring and stupid for me to listen to these days.

But sometimes if you challenge them like above, they'll wheedle and go underground, and you have to try to catch them by the tail before they put on another form to get under your defences.

And sometimes if you challenge them enough and consistently, they will clean up their act, and come completely on your side with some really helpful information. Like in the above example, it would go something like this:

me: so what's the story?

voice: well, chips are one of the few ways you get enough fun and "crunch" in your life, they're the easiest way anyway.

me: so you're saying I need more fun in my life? Hmmm, you're right actually, I really do, how can I create more fun and "crunch" in my life without projecting that completely onto eating chips? I will also continue to eat chips occasionally, but I'm short-changing myself if that's the only source of fun in my life! Hmmm, creative project coming up!

This approach is derived from shamanism, btw, believe it or not. Anyone who has read enough of Carlos Castaneda's books will be somewhat familiar with this process. It's not everyone's cup of tea, but those of us who like to get to the roots of things might find it a fairly eye-opening method. Even if you still eat the chips, you will still have learnt something about yourself, and you may have an alternative to eating the chips next time.

I fear this tent will have a lot of long posts in it, at least from me!

Fantastic work, @Kentishlass, for being able to transform you inner critic and saboteur into something that is more supportive! Well done that woman!! Self-love really is the name of the game IMHO. It takes time and awareness and practice. Sometimes at the start it's really hard to find out where our eating behaviours come from they seem so non-sensical, but it's like going on a tiger hunt - you may still eat the food that you weren't hungry for, but you've also hopefully tracked a tiger who you can either neutralize or make into your ally. (For those of us interested in Castaneda, he calls it "stalking"). Oh, that reminds me of one of my favourite songs from Playschool (kids' TV show in Aus).

We're going on a bear hunt (rpt)
We're gonna catch a big one! (rpt)
I'M not scared (?) (rpt)
What a beautiful day (rpt)

oh, grass, whibbly scribbly grass! (or forest or whatever obstacle)

We can't go over it (rpt)
We can't go under it(rpt)
We can't go round it (rpt)
We'll have to go through it!

Now, you a lot of you are going to think that I've completely lost it - but, I've just realized it's part of my project to have more fun and learn something at the same time! (see previous post!)

So I hope you all have a fun day!!

Well now....am liking the look of this tent! Think I might stay a while.....

Come here whenever you like...to explore why we have developed dysfunctional relationships with food:-

~ Why do we crave?
~ Why do we use food to reward or punish ourselves?
~ What part does our childhood/past play?
~ Why do we eat mindlessly?
~ Why do we eat...to our own detriment? The health repercussions......
~ Hormonal eating
~ Depressive eating
~ Habitual eating (irrespective of hunger)
~ .............................(feel free to fill in the blanks)

Fellow fasters, let's get it all out into the open! Let's scale new heights of understanding! We have such a wealth of goodwill on this forum, not to mention knowledge & experience......so it's time to pool!

Yay, @Hazelnut, sounds awesome! I am into it! You are such a brave woman, as I have said before!

Just wanted to mention, though, one of the reasons this tent hasn't made it up before, and why some people may be hesitant to join - yes, da-da, it's SHAME. Yes, I'm talking about you, Shamemaker! Come out from lurking behind that dark cloak & breathe some fresh honest air for a change! So much easier, sometimes, to think of particular foods being the problem, when the problem is actually shame, both internal and occasionally external (like someone will shame us blatantly in the outside world). That is always guaranteed to make me eat for comfort! But maybe an alternative would be to call them on it, whether they're an internal figure or a real flesh-and-blood shamer. Just like,"I see you there, you're trying to shame me, aren't you? Well, it won't work, because I love myself too much these days to let you do that to me!" (In an ideal world, right?

Now I think Brene Brown has written a whole book on the topic of shame, I have't read it yet, has anyone? I think it's called "daring greatly - how having the courage to he vulnerable..." Etc etc

Lets see, shame... Being called 'Thunder Thighs' all my childhood, even though i was a county and school athlete and a size 10 or 12. Being called this by my mother of all people. It ended up being a case of , 'no matter what I do exercise wise I will never have slim legs' (or basically never satisfy my mother). So I gave up exercise when I was 18 or so. For years I persuaded myself it was because I was more interested in boys and TV.

Ha yes my childhood nickname, coined by a friend's mum, was 'pudd'n' or 'pud'. It was a well-meaning and cosy name, and as a child I didn't mind, and quite enjoyed the fact that I had a nickname. She stopped using it when I was about 11, especially as it was probably becoming obvious that I was indeed a bit of a pudding! Even though I didn't mind it, I think it has left a trace of that being who I am - I am a stodgy pudding so maybe I've subconsciously been living up to my name.

I think our culture heaps a huge amount of shame on women (or makes us heap it on ourselves) around many issues, including food. A phrase I read in a book about women summed it up - we feel we are 'not enough and too much at the same time' - not organised enough, not attractive enough, not thin enough, not disciplined enough, but too emotional, too messy, too fat, too opinionated... whatever it is.

I totally recognise this feeling within myself - that I am not the 'other me' that is fitter, slimmer, more self-controlled, has an immaculate house, keeps up with all her friends, remembers birthdays and still has time to do all the crafts & hobbies I want to pursue, oh and have a great sex life too. This 'other me' actually sounds quite boring when I think about it but I still compare myself to her.

We are taught that women should not have appetites, especially for food. Men are looked at admirably if they polish off a huge 'man-sized' portion of food then go back for second helpings ('he's a growing lad' etc) - think of programmes like Man V Food. Women are taught that they shouldn't eat like this, that they shouldn't feel hunger or acknowledge it ('Oh me? I just can't eat big portions'. 'I forget to eat all the time!') and that if they do eat large portions they are somehow unwomanly, unseemly and greedy and need to apologise. I do this all the time to myself - my husband is very slim and, maddeningly, has a very high metabolism (probably due to all the exercise he did during his formative years), so can eat lots of food and not put on weight. Of course, he doesn't always do this, so we usually sit down to very similar sized meals. I then feel guilty for eating the same or even more than him when I should eat much less. He of course tells me to eat what I want but I still compare myself and then feel guilty/shameful.

It's a very hard cycle to break!

Further to the idea of it being unwomanly to have an honestly hearty appetite ...

On top of all the reasons for comfort eating, society in general does not approve of a third option for women. If we are perceived to be "fatsos" the only goal we should have is to be thin. Unlike men we are not supposed to turn that fat into muscle and become lean and strong.

Many years ago I read "Fat is a feminist issue" and learnt that some women deliberately put on weight as a shield against threats of various kinds. If they had the option of getting strong instead they could have spared themselves the health problems that come with that.

[Debs]

Blimey, this took off while I wasn't looking!! It wasn't my idea @Candicemarie, I just bashed in the tentpegs! And yes, @greenmonster, a nurturing yurt sounds just perfect, but no hippy paraphernalia or prayer flags please

@Jools7, to answer your question, my tipping point came as a result of two events, some horrendous bullying at work and my mother. I went and had CBT for the bullying to overcome my feelings of lack of self worth, the easting was linked into that. My mother, as I mentioned, felt fat and worthless, and her being bullied by my father didn't help. The final straw for me came when they visited us in Aus (note to self, never invite anyone, least of all parents, to stay 6 months ever again!). One day she had been going on about how fat she was and then commented that I looked just like her from behind!! I could not make her understand how that sounded, she said 'oh, no you aren't fat'. Doh! I immediately embarked on a 12 week program and lost 11kg and got to 57kg. I put it back on again and have lost some of it again, but I am getting there now, this time for good. I 'divorced' my parents and no longer have contact with them, my choice, and my head is in a far better place than it has ever been.
I recognise why I am eating, I am able to talk sensibly to myself and recognise my feelings. I can remind myself what the good things in life are, I have a wonderful hubby, beautiful home, I earn heaps of money to have great holidays. I just have a chemical imlabance that I mentioned on gym sparkles page that forces me to take SSRIs, and I accept that now. ok, I don't tell anyone, but that is my choice and I support anyone else to the hilt if I find out they are taking them.

@Hazelnut20 , thank you for sharing, you have been incredibly brave, and that is the beauty of a safe haven like this, although you all know my name and what I look like!!

Goodness, some painful stories, but also with some growth and redemption.

@Julieathome and @debs, goodness, some mothers have a lot to answer for! They dump all their junk and abuse on us and we're left with the side effects, and having to sort out the mess and love ourselves in spite of them! I can speak like that because I also had a very difficult relationship with my mother for all but the last year of her life, but that's another story! Good for you for doing what was necessary for your own health, @debs, and divorcing your parents, I'm sure there's a lot more you could say about that!

@Barbarita, Fat is a Feminist Issue is a great book, written, as I recall, by Susie Orbach, who also treated Princess Diana for her issues (don't know whether that's a good recommendation or not?) Well worth a read to understand some of the dynamics of our relationship with food for starters. I pretty sure that's partly where my method of "mirror work" came from - I'll maybe talk about that in another post.

I think our culture heaps a huge amount of shame on women (or makes us heap it on ourselves) around many issues, including food. A phrase I read in a book about women summed it up - we feel we are 'not enough and too much at the same time' - not organised enough, not attractive enough, not thin enough, not disciplined enough, but too emotional, too messy, too fat, too opinionated... whatever it is.

Yes, @greenmonster, but who are we allowing to make those judgements without question? I for one am no longer willing to sit back and take that kind of crap on any level - it's hard though, because some of those opinions are just assumed and intrinsic and get under our radar, we need to keep our antennae up, which can also be a bit too much 24/7!

oh goodness, I'm a bit too tired to keep writing! Night all! Remember to say something nice to yourself before you go to bed, or any time really!