The FastDay Forum

Hello,

I just joined the forum in the hope that someone might be able to answer this question, or at least give me some advice. I've done a lot of internet searching, including on this forum, but I can't seem to find anything similar to my situation. I'll try to keep this brief, but please bear with me! I saw the horizon programme last year, and it all made 100% sense to me, but I've been too scared to try it because I fear my situation is quite different to that of your average person:

I have been chronically/severly dieting by calorie restriction for the best part of 7 years, such that now I maintain my current weight (115lbs) on just 800-1000 calories a day (TDEE should be about 1600). If I eat more than that, I will gain weight - since the beginning of February, I have actually gained 5lbs by eating an average of ~1200 calories a day. This is an accurate number of calories, as I weigh all my food and track calories religiously (which I HATE doing, but I know that I have to be very strict). I have a very limited selection of foods that I can eat without gaining weight; my daily menu is typically LOTS of green veg, eggs, and fish/seafood. Even just a small deviation from this may see my weight increase and I am unable to lose that weight.

So, my question is essentially - will this diet work for me? Could it 'reset' my metabolism to a certain extent so that I am actually able to eat somewhat normally!? I am sick of being a prisoner to food and so trapped in this situation. I'd love to just not worry about food. I would KILL for a bowl of porridge, or a baked potato with beans....just to be able to be more flexible with food without my weight ballooning would be amazing.

Your thoughts/advice/personal experiences are much appreciated.

[Moogie]

Hi & welcome.

800-1000 calories sounds like an unhealthily low amount of calories - almost anorexic!

How tall are you? 115lbs isn't much at all, you must have a pretty low BMI unless you're 4'10" or less?

Personally I would suggest that if you've been living on so few calories you may need to see a doctor for advise on this front. Without meaning to sound judgemental it sounds very much like an eating disorder, forcing yourself to live on so few calories and being so strict about it all and feeling so trapped by food.

If you're gaining weight eating just 1200 a day perhaps that is also a reason to see your doctor. Could there be some other condition at work here, for example a thyroid problem or diabetes?

I wouldn't like to suggest 5:2 to you without being sure there isn't an eating disorder or other medical condition here.

Hi Moogie

I appreciate your reply, and to be honest, sort of expected someone to refer to potential eating disorder behaviour.

Truth be told, I did come very close to an E.D a few years ago but I can proudly state that I no longer have those kind of demons with regards to food. However, I think that's why my metabolism has taken such a hit...the infamous 'starvation mode' perhaps? Basically, if I COULD eat more food without my body packing it on as fat, I would!!! The only thing holding me back from eating normally is the fact that my body just wants to pack whatever I put in my mouth on as extra fat in all the wrong places!

I have seen doctors many times and medically, there is nothing wrong with me that they can find e.g. hypothyroidism etc.

I think the main point is that I am desperately trying to find a way of being able to fix the mess I made of my body, and thought this program might be the one to help.

Oh, and yeah...I'm pretty short - 5'2"

Do you exercise? I'm not very knowledgeable about TDEE etc. since my own metabolism is totally shot through thyroid disease and I am unable to lose weight on anything over 1,000 calories a day (I'm 5'1") and even then it's sporadic.

The reason I ask if you exercise is I'm wondering whether this might help you to re-set your BMR at a higher level - using more calories and enabling you to consume more to maintain? Just a thought and one that might have no merit.

I do think that if you have restricted yourself to a very narrow selection of food over a long period of time it is inevitable that you are now 'unable' to consume more carbohydrate dense foods without gaining weight. Your current regime is very prescriptive and inflexible and if, as you say, you are craving more flexibility it seems to have outlived its usefulness. I don't think a 5lb increase in weight is a huge price to pay and certainly doesn't sound like the 'ballooning' you describe.

I think you should ditch the diet mentality for a while and let your appetite, and weight, find its own natural level - this doesn't have to mean total lack of control but just a gentle relaxation of your rigidly enforced regime. Have a potato with beans; have some porridge now and then. You'll be happier for it.

[Moogie]

..and once you find yourself able to eat a bit more normally on a day to day basis, perhaps you can work in some 5:2 or 6:1 to keep the weight stable?

Thanks for not being upset by my comments, I wasn't meaning anything nasty by them, just a concerned citizen

[carorees]

Hi there. The folks over in the nerdy stuff section have been investigating the issue of starvation mode. True starvation mode does not appear to occur until very low body fat percentages are reached. Do you know your body fat %? Hypothyroidism is very underdiagnosed. People with hypothyroid have been shown to have very low metabolism indeed so that your maintenance level could represent your TDEE. When you lose weight your body tries to get you to regain it through various means including lowering your energy use not directly by affecting your metabolic rate but by reducing how much you move about (even things like wriggling in your chair might be reduced). All these things could result in the situation you describe.

Now, fasting does seem to affect the body differently. Several of us have found a paradox whereby if we eat more on our feast days we lose more weight than if we restrict, suggesting that there is some difference from normal dieting. But how to implement fasting into your situation is tricky. My guess would be that you could eat up to 1500 on feast days and 400 on fast days and not gain weight. So if you wanted to try this for about 6 weeks and not mind if you see some temporary weight gain, it would be a start. At the end of 6 weeks we could assess how you are doing and see what happens if you increase/decrease feast day calories. I would certainly stick with a low carb approach though perhaps allow a little potato or porridge on feast days.

There are some useful discussions in the nerdy stuff section on metabolism you might like to look at.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Thanks everyone - some really interesting 'food for thought'!

I guess my main motivation is actually trying to use this 5:2 method as a sort of system reset - weight loss is not my goal at this point. Weight maintenance and normalizing my body most certainly is and, based on the scientific research into this sytle of eating peaked my interest because it seems like a lot of the body's internal mechanisms are reset by this.

I don't exercise much, but I do walk a fair amount as I don't own a car and some days in my job can be fairly busy and I don't sit down. I've been trying to get into yoga, but that has been fairly sporadic so far! I want to do more cardio stuff again (I used to play a lot of tennis and run) but I usually just feel physically exhausted a lot of the time...which no doubt is linked to my diet etc.

I'm going to muse over your suggestions and check out the science-y forum.

Meanwhile, if anyone dose have any personal, similar experiences with having slowed metabolism through excessive dieting, and had success with the 5:2 program, I'd love to hear about it!

Thanks again for the kind replies so far I appreciate your time and input

I suspect the only way you're going to normalise things is to follow a refeeding protocol and eat say 1500 calories a day for a month.

Your fat gain is limited on this to about a pound a week, anything more is water weight. The water weight gain will be kept low if you moderate carb intake.

Searching for "refeeding" should find you some resources, for example http://www.dietitiansmentalhealthgroup. ... tients.pdf covers more extreme situations than yours but may be helpful. http://www.scienceofeds.org/2013/03/12/ ... a-nervosa/ is another which highlights some potential pitfalls.

You do describe the symptoms of anorexia nervosa, and professional help may be appropriate. "Anorexia nervosa is an eating disorder characterized by immoderate food restriction and irrational fear of gaining weight"

But that fat is there for a reason, as a woman you're supposed to have higher fat reserves than a man would and it's healthy to have that for times when you are ill, etc.

It's not right to worry about carrying a couple of extra pounds, particularly if they are subcutaneous fat on buttocks, etc.

You might think you've solved your ED issues but it sounds very much like you have some body image issues.

Fasting is going to mess with your head even more, IMHO, for now.

Have a read of this link...

http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2011/07/21/meet-staci-your-new-powerlifting-super-hero/

I'm not suggesting you take up weight lifting but the weakness you describe sounds similar and you can see how the body composition can change with exercise and proper diet.

Have a read of this link...

http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2011/07/21/meet-staci-your-new-powerlifting-super-hero/

I'm not suggesting you take up weight lifting but the weakness you describe sounds similar and you can see how the body composition can change with exercise and proper diet.

Hey

I REALLY like that link...I can really relate to a lot of the 'before' scenario...thanks!

It's good isn't? And something we can relate to, whether we lose the weight or gain even more.

Read the comments though, she really was ill at 117 lbs.

yeah i read most if not all of the comments too. I think this could be something that could help me at the point I'm at now. Maybe 5:2 could be something I could implement later on, when I've overhauled my system a little bit (a lot!). After all, the main benefits of the lifestyle go far beyond that of weight loss.

I came across this because I've started Crossfit and I like how much better I'm feeling. The toning from the weights is great and I'm also getting fitter from the conditioning.

If you do something to firm up your body and make it strong, when you put on weight, it'll be in different places to where it would go on if just larding out.

Weight lifters use IF a lot, look at Leangains, etc but at the moment, losing weight isn't something you need to do.