The FastDay Forum

I've only joined this forum and started the diet today but felt compelled to respond to this post.

As a bloke who has spent most of his adult life overweight to differing degrees, I joined WW 18 months ago and lost 3 stone fairly easily. Due to a job change with lots of travel, hotels and dinners, I've managed to put almost half of my weight loss back on and am really disappointed with myself.

Having read about this diet and spoken to so many people about how well it works, decided to give it a try.

I totally get where the OP is coming from and it isn't going to work for everyone, just like WW and SW doesn't either.

However, the maths behind this and any diet is very simple, if the amount of calories you consume exceeds the amount you burn, you won't lost weight. The reverse is also true so by creating a calorie deficit, you will lose weight.

Some of the terms used for this diet alarm me - a so called 'feasting day'. What's all that about?

I get the idea of normal eating between fasting but for anyone trying to lose weight, surely 'normal eating' is what has got us here in the first place?

I accept the body does odd things and you can lose weight when least expecting it but ultimately over a decent timespan, eating too many calories will lead to an increase in weight - I can vouch for that through personal experience.

I'm happy to try this for a month and see what happens, if the weight is shifting at a sensible rate- I've never been one of those who lost 4-5lbs each week- then I'll stick with it. But if like the OP's wife, it doesn't give the hoped for results, I'll first take a long hard look at myself and decide whether I've fooled myself with my eating or this diet simply isn't compatible with my aims.

Done properly, this is a calorie restricted diet working on the scientific finding that people do not overcompensate for the calorie deficit on fast days on subsequent feed days.

Everyone is overthinking this. Basically, eat less but eat enough, using the key mantra that when you are hungry, you can eat whatever the next day, as generally you don't.

This way of eating makes the whole thing more analogous to how people live, rather than trying to calorie restrict every day.

Once you relax, the cravings go away and it all gets easier. I can lose weight with SW or WW, I just can't keep it off. I'll be able to do this though as necessary.

Well, I'm no expert but hubby is a SW consultant and I have read his course work as I have an interest in nutrition in general and weight loss in particular. From what I've read I believe the SW system is supposed to give a general daily intake of around 1200cals. I have done quite well on it in the past but never got on with their new plan which is higher in carbs. I am doing better following a low carb plan as that has brought my glucose out of diabetic levels and I never achieved that on SW who tend to be afraid to move away from the low fat/high carb mentality. Hubby has lost 17 stones and elder son has lost 8 stones but I would say that it is proving harder to maintain that loss than either of them expected. I don't go to groups but I think they tend to discuss Curly Wurlys rather than partners! Maybe thats just because they have a male consultant and like to try and raise a blush or two!

SW do tend to encourage you to eat until you're full but the emphasis is put on high bulk/low cal stuff. For instance, at least a third of daily intake is supposed to come from a list of 'Superfree' foods which is basically veg. Its not foolproof of course as was proved by the bloke who thought he could eat 45 oranges a week because they were 'free food'!!!

The thing I like more about 5:2 is that I am getting used to the feeling of my stomach being smaller. I was never a subscriber to the idea of stomach shrinking but it does seem to be happening to me. With a few fasts under my belt I found it was a natural progression to let myself get hungry between meals rather than needing a sensation of fullness all the time. I will admit that when I first started I did have a little blip as I tended to go overboard on the idea of what was now not forbidden food but I soon realised that a more heathy intake in general made me feel much better in myself so now I save the treats to be just that. The difference being that I now enjoy them and they don't carry the guilt factor that spoils that enjoyment. I suppose it just resets the brain/stomach to how it should be.

I do hope you can sort out a plan to suit you and your wife. There is never going to be the ideal single, one size fits all plan is there?

First of all, if your wife is on the diet, why is she not posting on this board? She needs to take control of her own weight and health, or not. I don't understand why you are pushing her into a diet and then posting her results on the board.

Because she doesn't like joining forums and spending her time at the computer. It's not as sinister as you make out, she just needed a little convincing that this way of eating could work after many years of dieting.

Hi. You may have posted this already, but how long was your wife with SW. Did she manage to lose weight there?

I know slimming clubs aren't for everyone (my idea of hell), and for those who don't want or can't get to the meetings, it can be done online now. But the fact is, they do work for some people. My stepmother, her daughter, and my neighbour, have been members of WW for a while now. They reached their target weight, and now just go for regular weigh-ins. They've all managed to maintain their weight loss. So, I just wondered if your wife had had any success with SW? What wasyour motivation for suggesting she leaves? I get the impression you both like to enjoy a meal out or a take-away? Is your wife's dieting affecting your lifestyle? Don't mean to be rude, it just strikes me as a little unusual that you have been the instigator for the fasting, and not your wife. Does your wife want to continue with the 5:2? That's the only issue here, as far as I can see. If she does, then I believe if she listens to the good advice from people here, and is honest with herself about what she is eating, then I'm sure she will succeed. Perhaps she just needs time to get out of "dieting" mode, let her body re-adjust, and take it from there. From what you said, she had no problem with the fasting, so as long as she's not taking the "eat what you like" to ridiculous extremes, how can she fail?
I wish her well.

OK, quite a lot there.

When she does SW to the letter, she loses a pound or two per week. Any special occasions blow that out, one meal out = no weight loss, Christmas undoes 6 weeks of dieting, etc, etc. If you look at it over several years, she has had no success at all.

My motivation for recommending this was that I thought it would end the slog that she has been on for decades without really achieving anything and allow her to enjoy eating well while still losing weight. She doesn't like dieting, she likes food!

As for your last question, that really is the question

insx,
I can see a lot of myself in your wife's SW experience.
I have done WW for years and did the whole 'two steps forward, one or two steps back', which results in huge frustration for me.
I would then quit... gain a 'few more'... get more upset with myself, then go back at it again with renewed hope.. only to become quickly frustrated.

After starting 5:2 I had a wonderful 3 lb loss week one. An upsetting 2.5 gain week two. Then I came to the boards and found many positive suggestions, and decided to keep with it. I am eating until satisifed on my Non Fast Days, including some meals out and some wine. Week three I lost approx 1.5 and week four another two.
I have to admit I am feeling very positive and hoping that this 'is' indeed the answer for me and plan to continue this for some time to come.
I do also understand that every week will not result in a loss but I will try to stick with it. Good luck to you both. (and I do understand your being on the boards for information... I think it's very nice you are being supportive of your wife.)

Does your wife really want to lose weight? Excuse the curiosity but it seems like you're coaching her to do so. If I'm wrong, please forgive me but just give it a thought...
BTW, I'm quite new in this but my understanding is that if you're on a diet for 5 days and fast for 2, you probably won't have great results. It's probably the fact that you eat normally (neither as a sparrow, nor as a pig) on the 5 days that make you lose weight.

I think for long term weight management you first need to find out how to maintain the weight you are currently at i.e. spend several weeks learning what you can eat to enable your weight to stay roughly the same (even if that weight is too high).

Then if you start 5:2 you know what a 'normal' days eating is so that is an eating day and the other 2 days are 500/600 calories.

It seems that if you were previously dieting or constantly gaining weight you have lost touch with what is normal for your body (which will vary from person to person) so you may be more successful if you dont diet but try to eat 3 healthy meals every day for a month before starting fasting.

Just a thought, as I was frustrated on weight watchers because of the 2 steps forward 1 step back feeling if you have a 'bad' week, whereas I could easily maintain my weight. Once I started fasting that was the kick start I needed.

I hope that makes sense. I don't mean to patronise anyone, but if the goal is long term weight management it may need a total rethink after years of over/under eating

Hi insx,
I really feel for you're wife. I came here after a year of going to SW during which I lost 11/2 st in the 1st 6months the 2nd period I just yoyoed up & down, but that's beside the point. What I really wanted to say was that out of interest I started logging my food into "my fat secret" app & found that I was only eating about 12-1300 cals a day, was basically still following SW, I've increased my intake on feed days to about 1700 & weight loss though not fantastic is steady. I'm happy with this as life is more enjoyable for both my husband & I as he no longer feels guilty suggesting we go out for a meal or for coffee & cake, it's just a case of waiting till its a feed day!

I hope you can sort out a plan that suits you both, 5:2 isn't quick but is more socially acceptable TMWOT, I'll add that I haven't told anyone apart from my husband that I'm doing this & no ones noticed!

Sometimes I think the term "eat normally" is a little misleading. Most of us overeat, which is why we're on here in the first place. So eating normally to us is overeating to someone else. I've found this successful (12 lbs lost, 2 to go, in 9 weeks) because I fast strictly on two days, eat carefully for 3 days (working days) and at weekends more or less eat what I fancy, but without overdoing it, because the whole point is to re-educate your taste and brain to realise that you can't eat pizza, chips, chocolate etc in the same quantities as you used to. But it's nice to be able to go out with friends without having to be boring about it! So yes, in a way I am (nearly) always on "a diet" but I am learning that it's not a diet in the conventional sense, but a new way of eating which (hopefully) will stick with me for life. But if I really can't face the afternoon without a snickers bar - I can have it!

That's a way of living, not a diet, IMO. Most of us tend to overeat because we miss the "bad" foods. As soon as one tells us that -guess what?- you can have ALL foods, good and bad, suddenly the reason for overeating fades out and away. That's how I feel anyway...

I was on the SW diet for 3 months and did lose weight albeit slowly, but felt very cheated that I couldn't have the things I really enjoy. In fact I couldn't even spare syns for my daily cod liver oil tablet! When I read about the IF diet it seemed the answer to my dreams - 500 cals for 2 days and everything I enjoy and have missed out with on SW for 5 days. So, for 3 weeks I stuck rigidly to 500 cals on Mondays and Thursdays and on my feed days, as well as eating my favourite Thai meals (made with oodles of coconut milk) I was feasting on chocolate snacks and cakes. Result - no weight loss, but then, no gain either.

The I read Carorees's FAQ and learned about calculated my TDEE which turned out to be around 1780. This meant that I should have 25% on my fast days (445 cals, NOT 500), and around 1780 on the feed days. It means counting calories every day, which is a drag to be honest, but is now giving very positive results so worthwhile at least.

I think the term 'eat whatever you like' on feed days shouldn't be taken literally. If only dieting was that easy there would be so much less obesity.

I still manage to have a sweet treat on my feed days but it does need to be taken into account. I hope your wife can find a way through this because for me at least, Slimming World is history!

My wife is going back to Slimming World where she will diet normally for 7 days a week rather than dieting moderately for 5 days a week and dieting severely for 2.

Or......

My wife is going back to Slimming World where she will calorie restrict 24/7 and have all the life sucked out of her rather than eating normally for 5 days a week and fasting (with all of it's health benefits) for 2.

It's just so sad that she is returning to a system that she has 'flogged' for years without success, without giving this one a real try and learning what a normal amount of food is.

@Mizztraveller & @insx:
I don't think Dr M or Mimi ever said 'eat whatever you like' on 5 days. I think it's a (deliberate?) misinterpretation of the injunction to 'eat normally' on 5 days. As Tass has pointed out, that might require a bit of re-education and it certainly isn't an invitation to gorge.

If we were to distill the Fast Diet into a single sound-bite, it would all come down to 5:2. That’s five days of normal eating, with little thought to calorie control and a slice of pie for pudding if that’s what you want. Then, on the other two (non-consecutive) days, you just eat a quarter of your recommended daily calorie quota. That works out at 500 calories for women and 600 for men.

OK I just found someone who's written his own book about 5:2 which does use the term 'eat whatever you like'. A good reason not to buy his book!

I thought you guys liked sweeping generalizations?

So they talk about Curly Wurlies?

Okay, cool.

I have been twice, once for about 3 months before I got married in 1999, and then once again in 2008.

For me it was like 6:1 as you never ate anything on the day you were weighed, and I did get a bit fed up with "Brenda" who would sit and describe how good she had been all week, but looked at a Cream Bun walking past Warrens and put on 4 stone!

The Red and Green stuff works though, but the Food generally is green, and tastes Yuk or Red and bloomin expensive!

Anyway, the point is success in loosing weight that we want, hopefully we'll all find what works for us, and stick to it.

PennyForthem, it's hard to say what she was eating, calorie wise on Slimming World as it isn't a calorie counting diet. She has filled in myfitnesspal a few times so I could probably post a fairly typical day from that but a typical weekend involves having a chinese or going to Pizza Hut. This is bringing on the frustration again though, the whole point was not to be endlessly calculating calories, weighing stuff and worrying about what she was eating but I understand that it would be helpful to know.

Herein lies some of the problem I think. I believe most of us have little clue just how many calories we are ingesting by eating chinese or pizza (especially Pizza Hut!). For a large pepperoni hand-tossed crust, 1 slice = 310 calories (based on their website, it could be more or less depending on how the worker cut the slices). Most people I know eat more than 1 slice. Even at 3 slices, that's almost 1000 calories alone in that meal. I know for myself that I have a distorted view of food portions (common in America now days!), and getting a grasp on "eating normally" my 5 days sometimes feels like 'dieting'. As others have said, this is more a WOL and learning and changing your eating habits for the better. I've been doing 5:2 for just 3 weeks, the first week I lost 4 pounds, and since I've lost only a 1/2 more, BUT I've also lost some fat as my waist has actually shrunk some. It's not just all about the scale!!

I wish your wife well in whatever choice she makes!