The FastDay Forum

http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/84/2/578.full

Hypocaloric diet with 1000 kcal deficit subject to 1200 calorie minimum, diet was unspecified composition. Participation was restricted to women with a body mass index (BMI) between 28.0–35.0 kg/m2 and included nine women who were postmenopausal. Exclusions included psychiatric instability, known eating disorder, history of gastrointestinal surgery for weight reduction, active concurrent medical problems, pregnancy, or diabetes

"The weight loss diet consisted of a commercial liquid nutrition formula plus two high fiber muffins and a sodium supplement daily."

The weight loss of all subjects was evaluated at 30 days. Volunteers who had lost, on the average, 1 kg or 1% of their initial body weight/week were defined as weight loss successes and continued on the weight loss diet for another 30 days. The failures were discharged from the study.

Splitting the 20 successes into "insulin resistant" and "insulin sensitive" shows the two groups had the same weight loss despite marked differences in insulin levels and insulin resistance (SSPG) :

Fasting insulin (μU/mL) 10 ± 1 19 ± 3
SSPG (mg/dL) 91 ± 7 225 ± 18

There is no significant difference in the baseline characteristics of the successes and failures http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/84 ... nsion.html

What about Thyroid "function" Phil, that is the other thing that keeps coming up as a possible factor?

Very interesting though, great post!

They didn't provide or mention any thyroid data in the paper Bob, nor metabolic rate information. I did wonder how many of the "failures" for example had smaller calorie deficits on account of the 1200 calorie minimum.

Wouldn't it be great if we had "open data" to access all the useful information collected in these studies that doesn't get written up.

Interesting Phil. Do we know what the make up of the diet was in fat/protein/carbs. Bearing in mind the other discussion here wouldn't we expect to find one group doing better with low carb diet and one better with high carb diet. Of course if this diet was just in the middle that might explain why they did the same...

[carorees]

I eas going to ask the same question. What was the make up of the diet? And what was the calorie content?

[wildmissus]

I agree with Philt about 'open data'. My first question was what made the 'failures' fail which follows on from Caroline trying to find out why some folk lose lots and others don't. I am not a nerd but what I do follow and understand is really interesting. A lot of the nerdy stuff seems to rule out things 'it can't be' but not a lot says what it 'could be'. A guess it takes a lot of experiments to find the positive answers. The one about the balance of carb/fat proportions could well be on to something though.

Hypocaloric diet with 1000 kcal deficit subject to 1200 calorie minimum, diet was unspecified composition.

So calories was the smaller of (TDEE - 1000) and 1200

diet was unspecified composition.

Poo.

(As in 'bother'...)

[carorees]

PhilT (and other nerds) have you signed the alltrials petitition to get all data from all trials published?
http://www.alltrials.net/

A bit of groundless speculation perhaps, but an example commercial formulation http://www.wyethnutrition.com.my/our-pr ... ercal-plus which has a GI about 60 and "240 cc of formula containing 360 kcal, 14 g protein, 49 g of available carbohydrate, 12 g fat" which I make to be 15%P/54%C/30%F.

Optifast, a VLCD product, comes in at Calories 160 Protein (g) 14 Carbohydrate (g) 20 Fat (g) 3 which is 35%P/50%C/15%F.

So it is likely that the diet was high carb.

have you signed the alltrials petitition

I have now