The FastDay Forum

I really need some motivation to sort out non fast days!
Almost all of my fast days have been easy! I have only failed a couple as not eating isn't bad.
Eating well, mindfully, within reason is tougher and takes more self control! I am struggling with self control. What on earth am I playing at? I have even tried the eating window to limit how much I eat, but I can shovel grub in much faster than necessary mine is more a patio door than an eating window, even when it's only 4-5 hours!
I have had a bit of a stressful time, but I am just using that as an excuse, justifying my bingeing.
This needs to stop!
I am going to pledge to list my food in my journal, as that might stop me overeating.
I know I'm not the only one who struggles with this.
I went out with a friend last night and she said she'd been doing 5:2 for a week and hadn't struggled with the fast days but......
I didn't let her get any further as I find it embarrassing discussing just what I eat on other days!
I might have to bite the bullet and chat to her about it!
If I could stop this bad habit, I know the weight would go, instead I continue my self sabotage

Oh you're DEFINITELY not alone @karenm Its definitely feast days that are more trying/difficult than fast days. I'm finding 16:8 has helped me with this...although I have had the odd rice krispies indulgence...but nowhere near as often as normal.

Its trying to find food that is filling and maybe tell yourself you are fasting so that you can remain in the fasting mindset. It is a difficult one isn't it...but at least you ARE fasting twice a week!

[carorees]

I have had a bit of a stressful time, but I am just using that as an excuse, justifying my bingeing.

@karenm you're not using it as an excuse, there is a real physiological reason why stress makes us hungry, as a couple of threads recently have highlighted. And I've written about it in the article should I fast if I'm stressed out?

You should certainly include as part of your plan not beating yourself up about having a body that responds to stress in the way it's designed to! Maybe mindfulness might help? Also beware of worsening your stress by a plan that requires huge amounts of willpower.

Take care and have some [[[hugs]]]

Same here. I've not shifted an ounce this week and it has to be the non fast days. I often use having a bad day/work doing my head in as an excuse, but I can't see that changing anytime soon so I have to find some other way of dealing with it. I'm hoping it's just a phase, as before the summer I was doing fine and able to not eat too much garbage in the week. Hopefully we can get past it soon.

Caroline @Carorees? While you're there. Did you lose your weight by sticking with 5:2 only and then 16:8 all the time?

Yep feed days have been my downfall too..but theres more comes into play than us just being weakwilled,like caro@carorees points out
Sometimes seems like bodies WANT to be fat and i guess they really do..coz it means there are fat resources should famine strike..they don't care about dress sizes etc,just the need for survival
You need to cut yrself some slack tho karen as life has been hard for you recently x

Caroline @Carorees? While you're there. Did you lose your weight by sticking with 5:2 only and then 16:8 all the time?

Hi Beanie Bobs @nursebean I know you addressed your question to Caroline and I'm sure she will get back to you but in the meantime back in Balletland, I did 5:2 but I found that as I got nearer to my target weight I was naturally shortening the hours during which I ate, every day not just fast days and this way of eating has stayed with me ever since. For instance, yesterday I ate lunch only, was so full that I couldn't contemplate eating again and today I still have not broken my fast and I won't til about 2 P.M. giving me a nice long 24 hour fast and then I may only have the one meal again, it depends how I feel. I would rather eat one substantial, but healthy, meal a day than snack and never really feel full even for the same amount of calories, fat, carbs etc. knowing I can feel truly sated once a day makes this a great way of eating for me. Hope this helps til Caroline pops in again.

Ballerina x

[carorees]

Caroline @Carorees? While you're there. Did you lose your weight by sticking with 5:2 only and then 16:8 all the time?

Yes, just 5:2 for 8 months, then 16:8 from then on, no mixing!

I deliberatly took myself completely away from fasting for nearly 3 months as the stress of non-fasting days was adding to the stress I was already under. I did put on weight, but not as much as I would have pre fasting (it would have all gone back on in the past, plus some extras).

What I did find helpful was to NOT do any challenges as they just added to the stress. I also did a full weeks meal plan so I knew exactly what I was having, making sure I piled the veg up sky high (the extra nutrients will also help with stress) and not having 'treats' in the house.

[Debs]

Karem, for what it's worth you aren't alone. I have taken a long time to get my eating under control and even then it doesn't always work. Having said that, I have found a combo of more fat, low carb and being accountable via recording my food is the only way I can keep myself in check.

Every night I walk into the mess (in a mining camp), I am confronted by mounds of food, mostly junk and poor quality, chips, etc etc. added to that a huge dessert selection, it can get pretty tough. However I tell myself I can have it once a week, and do. The office is full of food, but none of it is good for quality so I try and eat mindfully and be discerning.
I hav a very, very stressful job, and that has really stymied my weight loss but I am keeping going as the alternative is that blow out like a barrel! I am finding that not making too many decisions about what to eat, otherwise I tend to obsess too much.
Good luck karenm!

I know feed days are my problem as fasts are easy! My main issue is I eat when I am not hungry. Only I can correct this I know and I really do not understand why I do eat. I can fast feeling hungry and not eat but as soon as the green light comes on it all goes to pot! I seriously wonder if I will ever get this under control.

@Karenm I think it's always good to talk so I'd bite the bullet and talk with your friend if you think they are the right person. I've looked at your tracker and see when you started 5:2 last year you were very successful - how did you control non fast days, was it a settled period, less stressful?

I am also learning to eat sensible portions on feed days. It is so easy to eat for comfort during stress. I struggled with this all my adult life.
I eat more food on feed days when I fast 5:2 and that is the main reason I choose 4:3. For some reason the MWF day fasting keeps me from wanting to eat as much on feed days. If I have time off (like a week vacation) the eating monster rises in me. At this point I can't go more than 3 days without fasting. This makes me worry about gaining all the weight back during the maintenance phase. : (

Apologies to those who've seen me write this before...

My anecdotal observation from various IF sites is that feeling out of control with food or over-eating on non-fast days is common.

The
Happy Eaters
website has a forum where people discuss useful books. From various IF sites, my anecdotal impression is that it seems as if the sense of deprivation or restriction that accompanies IF for some people can trigger binge eating episodes (my impression is subjective and from people's reports and they tend to be at the less painful end of the clinical continuum - tho' still distressing), a sense of loss of control around food, or over-eating. One of the books that I've regularly seen recommended and commended is:

How to Have Your Cake and Your Skinny Jeans Too: Stop Binge Eating, Overeating and Dieting For Good Get the Naturally Thin Body You Crave From the Inside Out by Josie Spinardi (it's a Kindle but there's an app. that allows them to be read on phones or computers).

The overviews that I've seen highlight the following points:

The Dieting Triangle of Despair: Diet ---> Binge ---> Beat Self Up for Perceived Lack of Self-Discipline and Resolve to

Diet etc. etc.

Spinardi identifies 7 common reasons why the usual forms of dieting are inappropriate for sustainable, healthy weight loss:
1 Dieting intensifies cravings and preoccupation with food.
2 Dieting makes you eat more, not less. (For every diet there is an equal opposing binge. The extent and ferocity with which you binge is directly proportional to the extent to which you restrict what you eat.)
3 Dieting makes you feel out of control with food.
4 Dieting increases both emotional distress and the likelihood that you'll eat in response to the stress.
5 Dieting creates a whole new category of overeating called "Eating Cuz You Ate."
6 Diets don't model naturally thin eaters' behaviour.
7 Diets do not resolve the real reasons you eat when you're not hungry.

Spinardi emphasises what she calls Hunger-Directed Eating and highlights 5 types of Non-Hunger Eating:
1 Gasping for Food
2 Eating Cuz You Ate (I've blown the FD, I may as well carry on blowing it)
3 Mean Girl Munchies (the hypercritical inner voice that many of us have)
4 Licking Your Wounds
5 Recreational Eating

-----

"When deprivation is involved, not only to the pounds stay put, your feelings of powerlessness soar. So, an eating approach that completely eliminates deprivation is not only favorable, it is crucial to successfully achieving your long-term leanness."

"Binge eating is the natural result of food restriction, while emotional eating is the result of a (completely solvable) deficit in one's emotional management skill set."

[Re: food choices} "Because managing your behavior by an iron will - rather than autopilot - is a constant, energy-draining source of conflict and tension. You're in an undending arm wrestle between "Do It!" and "Don't do it!" The instant you're weakened, distracted, or slightly off your game, your resolve caves in the direction of whatever is the least painful, and most pleasurable in that moment."

"Hunger Directed Eating is not the Eat-When-You're-Hungry-and-Stop-When-You're-Full Diet. This completely undermines the effectiveness of these body-connecting habits by turning them into a diet with two rules--waiting until you're hungry and stopping when you're full. As we've seen, all sorts of things go (terribly) wrong when we introduce rules into our eating. Foremost, it leads directly to more overeating."

"If physical hunger isn't what launched your current eating episode, then how in the world is being satisfied going to be what signals you to stop? Hunger and fullness are like two bookends. If hunger is what starts you eating, then feeling satisfied would naturally be what makes it easy to stop. However, if feeling frustrated with a project at work is what initiated your eating, then what is your signal to stop? When the problem is solved? When the chips and salsa are gone? When you hear someone coming down the hall?"

Some people don't seem to feel deprived or restricted with IF but others do - it's not clear why and it seems that feelings towards fast days can change over time.

As far as I can tell, people tend to pick the bits of the book that work for them and ditch the parts that feel like they'd be onerous (such as her suggestion to check in with yourself after various food choices and meals and record your rating for hunger, mood, energy and concentration at various times tho' that seems to work for some people who use it to collect baseline data about themselves ).

In the past year, I've seen a number of people on a different forum adopt Spinardi's advice in various food areas and they've mostly reported positive changes in their drive to binge or over-eat or they've regained such a sense of calm with food that they describe it as empowerment that they've never previously experienced. And, these are people who are managing to pull off the neat trick of combining this with IF whereby the fasting is an unbreakable contract that they have agreed with themselves rather than perceived as restriction/deprivation.

I've no idea if any of the above might be helpful to you. I've seen several references to her videos on YouTube and they're well received. Good Luck.

When I started 5:2 last year and was successful, it was immediately after spending a year exercising and calorie counting. I think I did calorie count on non fast days as I found I didn't eat enough otherwise.
I find it easier when I don't have to think about, bake or cook for everyone else.
My hubby isn't really being supportive with the fasting and gets a bit grumpy when I bring it up. But that's mainly because he wants me to magic a spare couple of hours a day to go for a walk with him.
I will log my food for a couple of weeks and make myself accountable! I am very likely eating instead of drinking! I am drinking far less fluids than I was (and doing no exercise at all )