The FastDay Forum

You guys have got to check out this article:

http://www.healthista.com/nutrition/fas ... -52-diets/

Wow. I'm spending a fortune on books lately, but now hers is on pre order for December. Now that I have a clear understanding of why she's so pissed off, it's understandable.

I am going to give alternate day fasting a shot. Anything that will help me lose faster I've got to try. I'm so fat, I just can't stand it anymore. Yeah, you can call me desperate. I'll start on Monday. Anyone else doing it?

Please read the article and let me know what you think? Her facebook page (there's a link at the end of the article) is really nice too. This gal knows what she's talking about.

What do you think? Am I jumping the gun too soon? I guess I finally reached a point where I just look and feel totally horrible.

I found out about 5:2 on one day, saw the program the same day and did my first fast the next day.

Interesting article.

I've added a half-fast on Friday in addition to the full ones that I do on Monday and Wednesday, and it feels like that did speed things up a bit.

I don't know if I could really do every other day, it's very extreme.... though I've started skipping breakfast on non-fast days too, except weekends.

Gosh, it's nice not to have to worry about fasting on the weekend.

I guess just being flexible, and also putting some fasts in, skipped meals in also is a little like every other day, playing with time - so that I eat less calories in a week...

[Debs]

Interesting, but ADF is precisely why Mosely decided it wasn't practical long term. For me, fasting every other day probably wouldn't work as work, friends, life gets in the way.
On the appetite reduction, I have found that comes naturally; I have been doing two days of fasting in the week and three days of 16:8 (in fact due to not feeling hungry I am doing a 16:8 today as well), and eating what I want on the weekend. Yesterday I had a slice of toast and then went to the market intent on devouring my favourite pie and doughnut. I had neither as I just wasn't hungry. What is going wrong with me? This is the girl who could eat for England?!
My stomach has shrunk and I can't eat so much doing this (just waiting for it to shrink with the tape measure now!).
Do what works for you and isn't going to interfere with your life too much as that was the point of this, that it fits in with YOU!

I've been doing 4:3 all along. I can't really say that it is superior to 5:2, but I like the rhythm of it.

It's good to remember that she is also now trying to sell a book. I think she is being a little unfair to Dr. Mosley. I felt that he did quite a good job of explaining that the diet he chose to follow hadn't actually been proven.

Has there ever been a study directly comparing 5:2 with ADF?

While I'm sure it isn't likely to be a popular opinion on this site...I whole heartedly agree with Dr Varady. I have basically said the same thing in posts here before this. Many people give Mosley way too much credit. He is essentially the telejournalist who brought the story to the world; tweaked it a little to make it personal and then wrote a book about it. He used his name, fame, TV show to make IF methods popular. He didn't invent it or do the research. The methods were around long before he tried them. I did ADF and 4:3 for the first time 5 years ago after reading Dr Johnson's ADF book. I don't think Dr Varady is being hard on him. Her studies were on ADF not 5:2. I got the idea for 4:3 in the same JUDDD book by Dr Johnson. It was one of his suggestions for people struggling to stick to ADF or to try for maintenance.

I think it is similar to what Dr Oz or Oprah do with a book, movie or diet plan. Except in most cases they don't write a book and end up getting credit for the diet plan. They most times promote sales for the person who actually did the work, wrote the book, starred in or produced the movie, etc. The person who brings the story to the world isn't usually credited as the creator of the work.

[Debs]

I think at the end of the day, it comes down to the fact that it is working for the vast majority of people who are doing this and without Mosely most of us would never have come across fasting as a legitimate method of calorie control.

I, for one, have been sucked in by the need to eat a big breakfast (based on what? One small experiment a very long time ago), plus all these 'twelve week programs' designed to part you from your money and sell add on bars, shakes, books etc etc.

For the first time in my life I feel in control of my eating and my hunger. Ok, like everyone I occasionally go ott, but it is working for me and the weight is coming off. As for the scientific side of it, I don't pretend to understand that side of it and I am aware that much of it is still in early stages. I do know that I am conducting my own study by ditching the cholesterol tablets and seeing if fasting can reduce my LDL.

I will be interested to see what others think, but as far as I am concerned it works for me and if there are long term health benefits then even better, but the long term benefits of not being overweight are good enough for me!

I understand what she mean but for me ADF is really not sustainable. I run a deficit of 2000, 2500 calories a week doing 5:2 wish in theory equal about half a pound to 3/4 of a pound loss a week. Anything more would leave me depleted considering my level of leanness . People with more weight to lose can afford to have a bigger deficit.

surfing around I found this as well: http://www.weightymatters.ca/2013/04/di ... -diet.html

It speaks to two issues: do Mosley and Spencer deserve all of the credit they're getting for IF and do they misrepresent the science.

I can imagine some scientists are pissed off. Mosley has been the one to shine with their research. Life is unfair sometimes.

What disappointed me about the article is that they don't dig into where Mosley is wrong. Apart from saying that 5:2 isn't based on much research. Is there any scientific proof that 5:2 has no effect? As well as on weight loss as on blood pressure, cholesterol and so on? That is what I would like to know.

Scientists have a busload of research objects by now. I wouldn't mind to be subjected to a scientific study about 5:2. Especially because it is so much more doable than ADF, it might be a far better answer to obesity.

I can't help feeling this is a bit of sour grapes!
It states quite clearly throughout the book that the studies are based on alternate day fasting. Mosely is very clear about the 5.2 being an experiment that he himself tried and had success with. The whole point about it being only two days a week is to make it sustainable for normal people and sustainable long term. ADF is not!
I think she has seen the cash cow and wants a piece!!

[Tracieknits]

Dr. M is IF Diet God and Creator... you cant complain about God!

..

(kidding but yeah in this commercial world its the first to go to market that wins.)

there have been heaps of IF books and sites but somehow and probably more through the power of Television and BBC Horizon that Dr. M. achieved such massive exposure.

Indeed i dont read Non fiction or science articles, so thank God for TV and Radio which is how i stumbled on this Way of Eating.

Massive anectodal evidence that 5:2 (and 4:3) is effective. Indeed, the thousands of forum members and those that join the Progress Diary are a "significant" sample set I believe.

Wanted to highlight something interesting in Dr V's interview -

"DON’T
Break up your meals on fast days  ‘For some reason, having three 150 calorie meals throughout the day doesn’t work as well for people as having one 500 calorie meal in the middle of the day on fast days,’ she says."

I know Dr M divided his 600 cals up into breakfast and dinner and that many on this forum have 2 or 3 meals on fast days and lose weight (as I have done). I just wonder whether weight loss would be faster with just one meal a day.

On the Dr V/Dr M debate - I think this is going to run and run. I can see both sides of it. Dr M (and Mimi Spencer) popularised the 5:2 WOL and made something quite difficult (ADF) more accessible for most of us. On the other hand, I can understand Dr V feeling aggrieved about her research being hijacked for something she doesn't endorse.

Ultimately, when the dust settles, I think we'll just have to make individual decisions about what suits each of us best for long-term sustainable weight management. Great to have an alternative to the old ways of thinking, though!

[Tracieknits]

I can't help feeling this is a bit of sour grapes!

I think she has seen the cash cow and wants a piece!!

Varady raised the cow, fed it and looked after it. It's her cow.

She could have written a book years ago, and cashed in, if that was her motive. She had the integrity to wait until she had done a sufficient number and variety of studies to do so. She should not be insulted for behaving responsibly.

"DON’T
Break up your meals on fast days  ‘For some reason, having three 150 calorie meals throughout the day doesn’t work as well for people as having one 500 calorie meal in the middle of the day on fast days,’ she says."

This. What is scientific about 'doesn't work as well'? What does it mean? That people find one meal a day easier? That they have better results? This is a good example of what disappoints me about this article. Especially when scientific proof is the point that is being made.