The FastDay Forum

Thanks for asking this as I am also confused.only been doing this for two weeks
I was drawn to this because I thought it wad another calorie counting diet
Anyway I went on to two different sites and found my TDEE is between 900 and 1500 depending on which site I use...I am small
So this means I havnt been able to loose weight over te years cos I have been eating too much:(
I always thought of myself as I healthy eater but even eating good food I eat way too many cals
So eating normally means nothing to me.and would I just loose weight if i ate 1000 cals each day?
I through this fast diet was about more than just eating less to loose weight?

Sugar is very good for you when it's used as a wound dressing

Like any other carbohydrate we don't need to eat sugar. On its own it doesn't carry any micronutrients either. Its strength is in making food palatable or desirable, acting as a preservative, providing colour, texture or bulk. In other words it's a food ingredient not a food.

Usually sugar is the most expensive sweetener or carbohydrate ingredient, so when it's used it is usually because it either does something unique or better than the alternatives.

How should sugar not be good to you? It's tasty and it's a good source of energy. All in moderation...

[Betsysgr8]

I'm sure it's like most things and moderation is the answer. I lived with someone at uni who bought into the whole 'fat is bad' thing and never ate anything that didn't say 'Less than X% fat' or 'Fat free' on the box. Box being the pertinent word - they only ate processed stuff. It wasn't healthy and the person's poor health in later life has borne that out.

Me too! I used to do everything fat free and thought "Oh cool, no fat and carbs are great". Now, I still have somethings fat free, namely diary but I fully enjoy 1/2 an avocado everyday but fast day, and chia seed and olive oil and natural peanut butter and etc and bread, pasta and potato are a few times a week, instead of every meal.

Sorry, I guess a little off topic.

Hmmm. Ok, to get back on target ... I feel I'm much more balanced and satisfied with the lower carb and higher fat meals I now eat. So much more food is available within my TDEE.

I always thought of myself as I healthy eater but even eating good food I eat way too many cals. So eating normally means nothing to me.and would I just loose weight if i ate 1000 cals each day?
I through this fast diet was about more than just eating less to loose weight?

yes, there are potential health benefits to 2 days a week with only 25% of normal calories ie about 500 calories.

the TDEE may be a helpful guideline if someone doesn't know how to gauge their intake, or if they aren't losing weight on 5:2, but if you don't need it don't bother with it.

Well to get back to my original question So Varady is using TDEE in her studies PhilT? I hadn't read that, so thanks. Madge I wasn't suggesting this forum made up TDEE I was saying that since I had not seen or read anything in conjunction with Dr Michael Mosley's version of the Fast Diet, regarding using TDEE on feed days, that it was something people on this forum had decided worked....and I add that if I HAD read that I wouldn't have ever started this...I have not counted calories for 30 years and have no way (or wish) of doing that as a lifestyle unless I wish to only cook at home, or eat processed food! However on my search for an answer to this question, I see that the authors of the 2 Day Diet - Harvie & Howell, have rules of counting calories in accordance with TDEE (plus eating a Mediterranean diet) on the 5 feed days - and they say 2 consecutive fast days proved easier in their research. So this has probably crept in here. I will add that although I have seen my tracker TDEE and worked it out on various calculators, with hugely varying numbers (what is heavy exercise? I walk for hours, 7 days a week, but it's not the sort of heavy exercise I used to do at the gym), I have never counted calories except on fast days. I have lost weight every week doing this - and eating/drinking what I like. I acknowledge that if I wanted to count calories 7 days a week and cut back on feed days I may have lost quicker, but hey as Mosley said, it has got to be sustainable and that wouldn't be for me. I also know a lot of people who are now fasting after seeing the Horizon programme...few if any have read the book...they have no idea about TDEE and are losing weight. My conclusion is this: Whilst Mosley makes no mention of TDEE as far as I can ascertain, some people find this a good way to stop the overeating that got them fat in the first place. Others, like me, don't want to feel they are on a 7 day diet. Amen

TDEE is used in the studies to calculate calorie restriction. For example feed day is 25% of TDEE in ADF with ad lib on feed days in one study. There is no study of Mosley's protocol as such. Often the intake on feed days falls short of TDEE or of the goal that is set.

Rightyo - I wasn't that clear - I meant sticking to TDEE (as in counting calories) on feed days. I have the vision stuck in my brain of Varady & Mosley eating the biggest burgers I have ever seen and them discussing that her participants were able to eat anything & as much as they liked and to her surprise it was only about 110% of their 'normal', as in usual calories. She had thought it would be 125% - also they lost weight...but remember all her participants were obese, so that's just 1 sector of the population.

Also, I have always taken the mantra of 'eat normally 5 days a week' as eat what YOU normally eat 5 days a week - not eat what 'normal' people eat 5 days a week. This is an assumption that if u do this you are cutting your cals over the whole week , whether u stick to ur TDEE or not.

However in weight loss there are so many factors at play - how close/far away from goal weight you are, hormonal imbalances, metabolism speed, high GI carbs or low GI carbs as a major or minor part of diet, age, sex, how many calories u normally eat, how many fast days (on this programme), exercise and many other personal things.

GMH,I am with you.i got into this because it looks like its not another diet.i am a serial dieter,and I do not want to count calories and get into that obsession again.i like the idea of fasting two or three days a week and then just being sensible on the other days with the occasional treat.by now I know what is fattening and have a pretty good idea of what is normal eating.i have been doing this for two weeks and lost a few cm around my waist ,not weighing myself for the same reason as not counting calories....too many years of obsession.this is a change of lifestyle for health reasons and to loose a few pounds.

Sarahg I understand where u r coming from. I think (personally) if you do your 2/3 fast days and u lose weight without counting calories on the other feed days, then go for it. If you don't lose weight then of course u need to look at what u r eating (gorging ;>) on feed days. But yes I'm with you on choosing this WOE as opposed to dieting 7 days a week. I was starting to feel with all this TDEE talk that I needed to get into line and start dieting on feed days and it was freaking me out! My weight loss has slowed but what-the-hell, I have lost 4/5 years of weight gain in 2 months and actually a friend just dropped in with a present and said I looked like I had lost more weight (only lost 200gms since I saw her last). Gotta be happy with that.

I am also in Australia,nice chatting to you.also good to see you are loosing even tho your BMiI is low.i too only have a few kilos to loose.just want to make this a way of life and slowly loose the weight without getting into the whole diet mindset .i was getting a bit freaked out by the whole TDEE talk,because I am small and middle aged my daily limit is very low and anyway I do not want to calorie count.drove myself mad counting WW points and lost nothing

where abouts in Oz Sarahg - I live on he Central Coast - yes I am losing consistently and only have a small way to go, so if I don't start stressing about 7 day calorie counting or wishing I was at goal yesterday then I can easily do this - fasting today - I only have 4 legged kids and they won't allow them into restaurants, so we are spending Mothers Day here and on the beach - stunningly beautiful day here, warm and hardly a cloud in the sky - and it's almost winter - magic!

GMH, the other thing about TDEE to remember is that as you lose weight, it will decrease. If you keep eating the same amount as you did before on feed days, there may come a time when you stop losing weight. Even if you're not counting calories (and I'm totally with you on this), this is good to bear in mind.

MaryAnn I'm just not so sure about that - when I lost 20kg a few years ago by giving up alcohol and taking up exercise I was stunned to see how I could anything I wanted & not put on weight - now I've never been so much a large eater as a sweet eater. I only put weight on again when I started drinking red wine again - I believe it's the carbs that do me in. But maybe it's what we believe that is what happens to us :>0

Further down NSW coastal area also such a beautiful day. GMH appreciate this thread full of great info