The FastDay Forum

@carorees kind of said what I was thinking - my only experience to date of doing v low carb has been the fat fast - I think the combo of v high fat seems to offset the downside of low carb so maybe that is worth considering doing in a modified way which is more sustainable that the fat fast of course!

best of luck

Thanks for all the advice gang. This site really is a life saver
@Julianna, I think it was carb flu, and I had expected it before I started. I felt rotten from day 2 but I couldn't continue past day 4. I was so ratty that the poor kids were getting the brunt of it.
@Carieoates, I love this WOE because it doesnt feel like deprivation. Or, at least it didnt! I have tried to build in a "little of what I fancy". However, I just cant leave the rest in the house! So, its easy to buy a cupcake rather than a full cake etc. However, we are a family of 5, so the full cake is bought. Then I eat the whole thing myself over a day or two. I do struggle with the hormones a bit, but I would pig out anytime! It will be a time of weight fluxes for me as I try to find that sweet spot.
@Carorees, I have been trying to go for paleo friendly fats when the munchies strike. I had heard before that i should feel more satisfied with fats abd protiens. So, I have peanut butter or cashewnut butter (no salt or sugar added ) by the spoon or on celery, handfuls of seeds, lump of cheese or an egg. It doesnt seem to satisfy me at all though. After several portions of all the above I could easily sit down to a full meal. I suppose I started this woe for a reason! But I had found that I was getting fuller quicker, but that seems to have gone the last few weeks. The old large me seems to be creeping back, along with all her bad habbits. I am wondering if my attempts at low carbing are just pushing me into that place where (subconsciously) I feel deprived.
@Rawkaren, I like the idea of allowing myself a plate of carbs a week. Mentally, telling myself "I can have it, but on Sunday" is much better than "no, never eat that"!

For me...when I crave carbs I really am not hungry. When I do eat the carb I want more. Like... it triggers the craving monster in me. If I eat a tad bit more than I should at a noon meal then an hour later I will want more...even when I am not hungry. So... I put off my noon meal as long as I can and that makes me eat less because I know supper is right around the corner.

Oh dear, I have to make a confession. My low carb pledge was a complete disaster last week. Need to pick myself up and do BETTER. Luckily there is always tomorrow/next week. )

Not sure if this has been posted before, but it is a reasonably balanced view on the pro's and con's of keto diets. @debs, you might find the bit about LDL interesting.http://ketodietapp.com/Blog/post/2014/0 ... et-Healthy

[Debs]

Thanks very much for that article @rawkaren, I have also forwarded to OH who is very sceptical about such things, high fat and so on. The whole LDL thing frustrate me as we are bound by such narrow testing available. I have done some fat fasting recently and have found that restricting my choice of what I eat has been very beneficial and also easy to do. Mainly because I don't have a decent choice of food anyway!
I am going to be testing my blood glucose as it was a tad high but it will be interesting to monitor it if it is true about artificially high levels being obtained.

[carorees]

Most of the effects of nutritional ketosis described in the article apply to fasting also: cholesterol changes, blood glucose changes, glucose tolerance etc. The physiological insulin resistance is worth noting and is why I recommend breaking your fast with low GI foods.

[carieoates]

Great article @rawkaren I found the part about being more sensitive when eating carbs once you've been low carbing than before.
Must read on.

Morning/afternoon/evening all. I'm on day 3 of high fat, low carb and low to moderate protein. I'm still Fast-5 ing, however I have switched it around to the end of the day now, allowing fat only before the eating window opens (bulletproof coffee). The fat is making the difference (70% of my calorie intake), and I'm still getting the benefits of fasting. I could not eat all of my calories during a five hour window, so this seems to be working for me right now as I don't want my calorie intake to get too low. The other thing that is bloody marvellous is himalayan sea salt. I guess it is the equivalent of drinking bouillon with all of the mineral benefits. Both the fat and the salt seem to be ameliorating the impacts of fasting when I'm under stress. I have no idea if this is going to work or not, but I'm feeling a little better every day so I'm going to give it a while and see what happens. http://besynchro.com/blogs/blog/7149480 ... layan-salt. I can't find any medical references, so don't know if @carorees can help.

Think today might be the last day of the continuous heat. It's going to be in the 90's (30's) again today, but temperatures are set to tumble later this week.

[carorees]

I found this bit amusing from that link @rawkaren

What Exactly Is Himalayan Salt?
Himalayan Salt is a unique type of sea salt mined from ancient sea beds at a specific site in the Punjabi region of Pakistan. It supplies an astonishing 83 unique trace minerals. There are 21 trace minerals that are widely agreed upon to be necessary for the body's metabolic processes. Most biochemists agree that there are very likely several (even dozens) more that the body will use when available. Most of the 83 trace minerals found in Himalayan salt are extremely rare (if not impossible) to find in food. Because Himalayan salt is mined from 200 million year-old sea beds, it is completely free of the heavy metals and other toxins that show up in sea salts harvested from today's oceans.

Although the heading says "what exactly is himalayan sea salt" he does not tell you what it is exactly as he doesn't tell us what minerals are in it and in what proportions! So it is impossible to know whether it is true that the 83 minerals are rare, hard to find in food or even whether the salt is free of heavy metals and toxins.

According to Wikipedia (so therefore also questionable)

In 2003 the Bavarian consumer protection agency Bayerisches Landesamt für Gesundheit und Lebensmittelsicherheit (the Bavarian State Office for Health and Food Safety) analyzed 15 specimens of Himalaya salt sold in Germany and could detect at least ten different minerals, in addition to sodium chloride (98%). The agency stated that the salts come from Pakistan and can, like all salts, cause hypertension (high blood pressure) if overused.[1] The chemical composition of Himalayan salt includes 95–96% sodium chloride, contaminated with 2–3% polyhalite and small amounts of ten other minerals. The pink color is due to iron oxide.

As to why you are finding it beneficial, I think you are probably right that it is principally the sodium and it is much the same as having any salty drink. The polyhalite (a hydrated sulphate of potassium, calcium and magnesium) is not likely to be adding any significant amount of mineral to your already good diet. Therefore, apart from the benefit of the sodium in the context of a low carb diet, I doubt very much that you would gain anything beyond the well-known placebo effect of anything that sounds exotic. Funny how ancient sea salt from the Himalayas is more beneficial than the brine from Droitwich for example! This article is worth reading: http://www.organicskinherbsonline.com/h ... -benefits/

@carorees. Sure you are right! I guess I'm trying to avoid that nasty manufactured white stuff. You can tell it's bad because it burns the back of your throat . This has a very mild salty taste - milder than sea salt - which I continue to use too!

Meanwhile I'm still in the novelty phase of the protocol. Today I have a broccoli slaw frittata for lunch with organic, nitrate free bacon in it, cooked in coconut oil and a side of avocado!!

[carieoates]

I must find out more about the fat fast. Do I need it I wonder. Is it great girls?

Going well so far @carieoates. Level of ketosis seems deeper so you are less hungry. Makes it easier to fast therefore. http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/fat- ... -loss/1189. However I'm doing a modified version of it - Bulletproof IF https://www.bulletproofexec.com/bulletproof-fasting/, so the only dairy I'm eating is grass fed butter. You might find that too restrictive, so the first link might be better for you. However just to warn you though, many peri and post menopausal women in some of the studies quoted (usually questionable), have to get their carb count to below 30g per day and very moderate protein (too much can knock you out of ketosis), meaning that the fat content can be very high and if you are not used to it then that can seem scary. I'm at 70% fat, but I have seen case studies in Keto Clarity that are higher. http://www.amazon.com/Keto-Clarity-Defi ... 1628600071 There are also studies that others have referred to on these forums that low carb also has a high failure rate especially with older women, but again, I think it must be hard to get real statistical proof. So the only way to try it is from own personal experience as everyone's journey is different. A keto diet - high fat, low carb (as opposed to just a low carb diet) is the only thing I have not tried in conjunction with fasting, and given I'm taking a very scenic route, then I have nothing to lose. I will keep you posted. BTW as you are not boozing, then might be worth a go as alcohol can knock you out of ketosis very easily, even zero carb stuff.

Hi, I have a question for everyone who has been trying the Fat Fast, @Debs for one, I think perhaps @Madcatlady, maybe @rawkaren - anyway, which of the recommended small, 200 cal. "meals" do you find the most filling and/or enjoyable? I've read all about it, seen the mac. nuts, cream cheese, etc. list but would love to have your input.
Years ago I was really quite successful on Atkins (of course, once I stopped it was a different story!!) but the thought of the Fat Fast scared me to death at the time. Now, I feel with 18 months of 500 cal fasts, a couple of days of 1000 cals of high fat sounds almost like a breeze!!!
What are your suggestions and opinions?

Yes, I'm curious too. I told you it would take a while for me to get my head around the idea of a fat fast @Debs, but I think I could do it next Wednesday and Thursday next week if it meant I could shift some of this weight as I have been ping ponging around the same 2.5 kilos for 6 months.